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PostPosted: Sat Apr 21, 2012 18:00 
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http://www.shropshirestar.com/news/2012 ... ic-orders/

Will it make any difference, I wonder? No one around our way seems to object anymore and if you do, you stand no chance of having any affect on the outcome.

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My views do not represent Safespeed but those of a driver who has driven for 39 yrs, in all conditions, at all times of the day & night on every type of road and covered well over a million miles, so knows a bit about what makes for safety on the road,what is really dangerous and needs to be observed when driving and quite frankly, the speedo is way down on my list of things to observe to negotiate Britain's roads safely, but I don't expect some fool who sits behind a desk all day to appreciate that.


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 21, 2012 19:19 
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I would say they should advertise them all on the Internet, and provide a feed so that interested parties are automatically sent a link to any new ones.

Of course, as we know, the whole "consultation" process is largely a sham anyway :x

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 21, 2012 19:33 
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PeterE wrote:
I would say they should advertise them all on the Internet, and provide a feed so that interested parties are automatically sent a link to any new ones.

Of course, as we know, the whole "consultation" process is largely a sham anyway :x


Definitely ,as they keep on harping about speeding being a major crime .I'd like to see those responsible for changing/lowering limits forced to place warnings about new limits for some time. I took this up with SCP on a change from 40 -30 ,where it had been done within the previous fortnight , and the only evidence was the markings on lamp posts where the repeaters had been . The comment from them was that they'd have to make certain all repeaters were removed . OK,I know I missed the entry sign , but in my defence ,it's placed where there are more important things to look out for .

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Drivers are like donkeys -they respond best to a carrot, not a stick .Road safety experts are like Asses - best kept covered up ,or sat on


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 2012 01:05 
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I assume that the high cost is due to the lengthy mass of information, so why don't they just state 'X road is to be X speed - deadline X date, and info at X website. That way locals who read the paper get a very basic note and all the official requirements can be located on the website pages. Job done ! :)
Both lots of people are 'happy'.
I don't think that I have ever, looked at a Council website to refer to speed changes. Most Council websites are hard to navigate and they need to be much improved.

Article for reference :
Campaign to protect newspapers’ role in publishing traffic orders
Saturday 21st April 2012, 10:00AM BST.

Campaign to protect newspapers’ role in publishing traffic orders
Almost two-thirds of people are concerned about proposals to remove the requirement for traffic orders to be published in local newspapers, according to a new survey.
The editor of the Shropshire Star, Keith Harrison, and Telford MP David Wright are among those calling on the Government to rethink the controversial plans.
Research found that 64 per cent of adults were worried about potential changes which would mean information on traffic changes would no longer need to be published in papers.

A survey by GfK NOP on behalf of industry body the Newspaper Society also found 81 per cent of drivers expected to be made aware of traffic changes in local papers.

The Department for Transport believes lifting the requirement could help councils across the country to save £20 million a year.
It plans to let authorities use “whatever ways they consider appropriate” such as Facebook, Twitter and their own websites.
The GfK NOP research found eight times as many people had read a newspaper in the past week than had looked at their council website (32 million v 4 million adults).

More than two-thirds of those interviewed (69 per cent) thought it was important they were made aware of planned changes to local raffic routes. Local papers was the most popular way in which most people expect to be informed about traffic changes (39 per cent), with the second most popular method being street signs (26 per cent).

Only 2.6 per cent of interviewees had visited a council website to look for information about planned traffic changes in the last year.
Newspaper Society representatives presented the findings to Transport Minister Norman Baker when they met with him to raise concerns.
The Department of Transport is holding a consultation process on the plans, which closes on Monday.
The Shropshire Star has joined the Newspaper Society in opposing the plans.

In his submission to the consultation process, Star editor Keith Harrison said: “Although the proposals are made as part of a government-wide drive to reduce regulation and unnecessary expenditure, we believe they represent a serious threat to the public’s right to know.
“Local authorities may not want to risk adverse publicity over proposed changes but this information needs to get to the widest possible audience for residents to be fully involved in a transparent process.”

One former Telford estate agent, who asked not to be named, has also joined the opposition and said: “The local newspaper is a vital tool in advising the public of local issues.
“Not everyone has the wish, or is able to access other media sources, which can be time consuming and complicated. The local newspaper is an integral part of a democracy.”

The editors of the Express & Star and Shropshire Star wrote to local MPs to highlight the issue.
As a result, Telford MP David Wright wrote to minister Mr Baker suggesting that the government thinks again about the proposals.

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 2012 20:25 
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SafeSpeedv2 wrote:
I assume that the high cost is due to the lengthy mass of information, so why don't they just state 'X road is to be X speed - deadline X date, and info at X website.


I don't read any local papers .BUT unless the reason is to cash in on reduced limits via SAC, then why not have a few notices along the length of the new limit advising myopic motorists that the limit has been lowered. That way ,the LA cannot be accused of cashing in ,and the change is for "safety" reasons, the desired effect has been produced.

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lets bring sanity back to speed limits.
Drivers are like donkeys -they respond best to a carrot, not a stick .Road safety experts are like Asses - best kept covered up ,or sat on


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 23, 2012 22:53 
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Yes they don't seem to have a problem stating the obvious like " Changes to road layout ahead" when there's a miniroundabout smack in front of you that you couldn't possibly miss but they will remove 40MPH signs, that have been there for decades, without warning of a speed limit change and yet speed is supposed to be the number one safety issue....mmmm.

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My views do not represent Safespeed but those of a driver who has driven for 39 yrs, in all conditions, at all times of the day & night on every type of road and covered well over a million miles, so knows a bit about what makes for safety on the road,what is really dangerous and needs to be observed when driving and quite frankly, the speedo is way down on my list of things to observe to negotiate Britain's roads safely, but I don't expect some fool who sits behind a desk all day to appreciate that.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2012 00:19 
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Considering that most of drivers are within the 85th%ile it is really only the 15%ile that behave above this level that they ought to be targeting. The removal of signs should be done only when they can replace with the new ones (putting aside whether change is valid or not), and then add a 'New Speed Limit' sign/s too. (I have seen them.)
People like to hear about their local area and of course newspapers have been one of the best ways of doing this for a very, very long time. To alter a 'knowledge base' for many who don't have internet access must seem to be very disconcerting.
I like my idea of taking 'to the press' a simple line of text, instead of the full legal document, which would seem to save funds and still provide the basic information for the general public. As papers charge for 'line of text' by 'column inches', smaller is therefor cheaper. As cost is the reason for dropping this why not just make it smaller and keep everyone happy ?
Surely they are obliged to inform the public?
Lamp-post notices tend to be lengthy and in very small print (for some people) which must discourage people to read them and for some impossible to read.
I wonder what the rate of communication is with the public after placing said notices ? Is it that so few responses make them think that few read them?
It irks me when I hear of comparatively small 'savings', and yet other projects and rewards continue, but we are told that there is no money?
If they were running a tight family budget they would have blown, it by now on some un-necessary luxury would they not? !

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PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2012 20:51 
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[quote="SafeSpeedv2"

Surely they are obliged to inform the public?
Lamp-post notices tend to be lengthy and in very small print (for some people) which must discourage people to read them and for some impossible to read.
![/quote]

Inform yes. But is it done in an easy to read/understand fashion in papers that will be noticed .Or is it printed up in legalese in small text on a lamp post and printed in some corner of a not so well read paper .I'd contend like some sites do ,that it's done this way to stop objections. Not that any notice of these is taken ,if the last lot of reductions in Warks are anything to go by . Police objected .Public objected. County Councillors objected. Council officers supported the lower limits, and in they came . Democracy UK style 2011 style .

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lets bring sanity back to speed limits.
Drivers are like donkeys -they respond best to a carrot, not a stick .Road safety experts are like Asses - best kept covered up ,or sat on


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2012 21:57 
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I can think of a wonderful way that councils can save a fortune over the problem of notifying the public over speed limit changes...just give the job back to professionals who know what they are talking about, such as the DfT and the police...simple enough really, less pointless speed limit changes anyway and the public would have more faith in the process and have less need to object.

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My views do not represent Safespeed but those of a driver who has driven for 39 yrs, in all conditions, at all times of the day & night on every type of road and covered well over a million miles, so knows a bit about what makes for safety on the road,what is really dangerous and needs to be observed when driving and quite frankly, the speedo is way down on my list of things to observe to negotiate Britain's roads safely, but I don't expect some fool who sits behind a desk all day to appreciate that.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 25, 2012 20:39 
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graball wrote:
I can think of a wonderful way that councils can save a fortune over the problem of notifying the public over speed limit changes...just give the job back to professionals who know what they are talking about, such as the DfT and the police...

But then ,you've missed out the real "experts " in road safety visa vis speed -Mrs double barrelled name and her group of geriatric WRVS matrons, who haven't quite worked out that a modern( to them ) gearbox has more than two gears ,and that the figure 20 on the speedo means miles per hour . :D :D ,and that No one ,and that means NO ONE, should drive faster than them , unless it's Capt Mainwairing .

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lets bring sanity back to speed limits.
Drivers are like donkeys -they respond best to a carrot, not a stick .Road safety experts are like Asses - best kept covered up ,or sat on


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