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PostPosted: Tue Jan 01, 2008 12:15 
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Happy New Year and welcome to the UK!!!

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/a ... ge_id=1774

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/a ... ge_id=1770

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jh ... tax101.xml

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jh ... ark101.xml

It seems if you are a tax payer, over weight, a smoker, drive a family car and get released from prison after being found not guilty of a crime you did not commit. Then this is not the place for you.

Tax payers will carry the can for government and council incompetence!!!

If you enjoy eating all those products that the government enjoy taxing to death then you can enjoy the government and the health service refusing you treatment!!!

Motorists are becoming government and council enemy №1.
The government are replacing real criminals with motorists, because you can get money from motorist and criminals cost money to process and imprison?

Even if you are found to be innocent and get released from prison they have the nerve to remove board and food from your compensation.

The bloody person who got the man put away should be covering the cost of his stay in prison.

Will Barry George, who was found guilty of murdering Jill Dando, on very dodgy evidence, be forced to pay for his stay in prison form 2001? If this is the case then we really do have a perverse society!!!

As I said welcome to the UK 2008!!!


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 01, 2008 12:20 
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Reading the first one, the first thing that sprung to mind was that Hitlers vision of a superior race is coming to fruition under New Labour.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 01, 2008 22:08 
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But with the rights will come the responsibility to lead a healthy lifestyle. There were fears last night that this could lead to smokers and people who drink or eat too much being refused treatments.

Already around one in ten hospitals refuse to carry out joint replacements for obese patients or orthopaedic surgery on smokers.


Presumably we will see potential suicide victims refused treatment, along with drug addicts, and charges for calling out the Coastguard and other emergency services?

On the second part however, that refusal is as I understand it only made on health grounds - ie carrying out surgery on patients with underlying problems is liable to prejudice their recovery.
Where an obese patient required say a shoulder replacement, it might go ahead, where as a hip or knee may not.
I'm not sure of the criteria for smokers - perhaps Mad Doc can fill in, but these refusals can be made in private hospitals, and in France.
My mother has had THREE hip replacements, both knees and a shoulder. In each case apart from the first hip done on the NHS, being a non smoker was part of the criteria for consideration, and an aid to her prompt recovery.
After the two hip and two knee operations in France, she was walking within 3 days of the operations.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 02, 2008 14:13 
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I think its a very dangerous thing to start dictating to people how they must live in order to qualify for medical treatment. The ONLY time I can see a genuine reason to refuse treatment is on purely mechanical grounds - ie a hip replacement will have a maximum design weight and if the patient exceeds that weight then the hip WILL fail.

Its the first step on a very slipery slope - how long before the NHS have the right to refuse treatment for any injury resulting in a 'dangerous' activity? (Cycling, biking, horseriding, boating etc etc etc)

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 02, 2008 17:45 
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mmltonge wrote:
Reading the first one, the first thing that sprung to mind was that Hitlers vision of a superior race is coming to fruition under New Labour.


and the superior race is who? At least hitler had a goal, a vision of a perfect blond haired blue eyed germany. however wrong that may have been it was a tangible end result for what he did, he had his reasons. the reasons nu-labour do things... are anybodys guess, they just seem hell bent on destroying society for everyone.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 02, 2008 20:26 
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ranger1640 wrote:
Motorists are becoming government and council enemy №1.

- Exactly what happened under the last Labour Govt., in the 1970s. Then it wasn't speed cameras, it was swingeing increases to petrol prices. I don't know if you're old enough to remember it, but Wilson's govt introduced a VAT rate of 25% :yikes: This was levied on "luxury" items like caravans, boats - and petrol. They did this just when they knew an imminent OPEC price rise would mean an 8p/gallon rise to the price of petrol, and the timing meant that the OPEC price rise gave the govt an extra 2p/gallon VAT.

Then... they found that business users were claiming back VAT on petrol, so they abolished the 25% rate, but then put up the duty so that the pump price remained the same, and the only thing that changed was that business users could no longer claim back as much VAT.

Some things never change, and the motorist has always been the goose that successive labour govts have expected to lay golden eggs for the treasury.


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 02, 2008 20:36 
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DieselMoment wrote:
Some things never change, and the motorist has always been the goose that successive labour govts have expected to lay golden eggs for the treasury.


Care to give me some examples of how Tory governments have been any different?

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 03, 2008 01:54 
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hairyben wrote:
mmltonge wrote:
Reading the first one, the first thing that sprung to mind was that Hitlers vision of a superior race is coming to fruition under New Labour.


and the superior race is who? At least hitler had a goal, a vision of a perfect blond haired blue eyed germany. however wrong that may have been it was a tangible end result for what he did, he had his reasons. the reasons nu-labour do things... are anybodys guess, they just seem hell bent on destroying society for everyone.


It's hard to define, cos, believe it or not - I'd say their requirements are even stricter than Hitlers, his were all about looks (er, also religion) - but Labour want your personality too.

You must be an athletic non obese, non-smoking, non-drinking, environment crazy car hating snitch who uses public transport.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 03, 2008 14:09 
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prof beard wrote:
DieselMoment wrote:
Some things never change, and the motorist has always been the goose that successive labour govts have expected to lay golden eggs for the treasury.


Care to give me some examples of how Tory governments have been any different?


Well fair enough. I believe it was the tories who introduced that fuel tax escalator thing, abolished by Labour after the 2000 fuel tax revolt. The tories certainly did tinker with company car tax, including making changes to base it on car engine size. There came a time when I took our little old Toyota Corolla 1.3 out of my company, because declaring it as a company car created a bigger tax liability than its total running costs!

Other than that, I can't recall any significant "whack the motorist" policies from the tories. They never levied a 25% rate of VAT on petrol, for example. But I'll leave you to add to the list I started.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 03, 2008 15:49 
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My late Uncle nearly died after surgery. It was a a result of his smoking. It caused a bad reaction to the Anaesthetic...

Mind you, he did like his ciggies! A lot! :)

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