Safe Speed Forums

UK papers reported yesterday's coach crash which caused the deaths of 26 Polish Catholics on a Pilgrimage to Fatima (Portugal)/ Lourdes and Notre Dame de la Salette as "brake failure".

French, Swiss and German press reported it differently. He was on the Route National 85 (the Napoleon Way -the one Napoleon took when he returned from exile to regroup for Waterloo) . This is an alpine twisty - full of climbs. He had a brake failure on one of the sharp descents. I think perhaps he had ridden the brake and overheated the system - perhaps causing the secondary system to fail as well A survivor was reported in "Le Monde"'s account as saying the coach was not speeding but the driver screamed to buckle seat belts as the brakes had failed just as the coach went out of control on a downward hard bend at Laffrey. The coach caught fire. Not known if overheated brakes or damage to tanks or combination of both plus friction on the rocks.


The coach (Scania model) had been checked in Germany three weeks ago. Its braking system was passed as "fine" at the time. I think then the driver rode the brakes and both these and the secondary system both overheated as a result. Perhaps those who drive HGVs might have comments as to my comment here.

However, we do know this road. We've driven it and ridden it in the past. There are umpteen signs saying that lorries and coaches are forbidden from the route because of the dangers of the slopes and perhaps the braking systems of these vehicles on such steepies. (Believe me - this route makes all other mountain passes pale into insignificance. It would not be a cyclist's dream as the uphills are almost perpendicular at a couple of points.)

There are no less than 11 huge signs telling lorry and coach drivers the road just is not suitable. However, none as I recall were written in Polish, Russian or whatever is spoken in the driver's country

French have opened an inquiry and it's looking at a potential "accidental homicide" charge as a possibility. (I think we call it "death by dangerous"


The French banned coaches and large vehicles from this road after several incidents - the worst being a Belgian coach came off the road in similar circumstances in 1973 - 43 died and 6 were seriously injured.

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French are quick to react though.

They intend to put more police on this road with immediate effect.

They intend more VAS/SID to alert on approach to this route too.

They intend to ban all HGVs from using the road.

They plan to re-engineer road to provide better protection for any mistake made by HGV driver in navigation skills und provide a "refuge lane to direct them away from this road und towards the safer routes"

(Sources: Le Monde/France Soir/Figaro/Matin/ Blick.

All available via Google News if you click on France/Suisse/Schweiz )

I think the French are being very sensible over this.

UK version of safety? talivan/Gatso .. send NIP 14 day later

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Aye, if labour were in charge over there, Speeding would have been blamed and thus there would be a speed camera every kilometer and then the government would use dodgy statistics to prove them effective :/

I heard something on the Euronews about whether or not the coach was fitted with a req'd secondary braking system, by which, I take it to mean: "re-generative braking". An electrical system which retards the speed by electrical loading of a generator and is highly effective.

It's NOT a new idea, it was around when Adam was a lad. But Virgin trains are using it in their adverts to show "how green and modern they are". Pity the really old Blackpool trams got there first...(Ok...I do know there is a slight difference).

Haven't heard anything since in the news though........