Safe Speed Forums

I wrote this question on the pepipoo site with no reply but it was at the end of another thread and I think I might have put it in the wrong place, so rather than post it again I wondered if anyone here had any ideas?

I was talking to someone last night and he was telling me that I can ask to see the evidence that the police have in relation to me 68 in a 70 area.
I also think that in some way if I use the nip sent to me I can see some more info on the camera site that filmed me.
The camera was one of those yellow boxes at the side of the road on the A590 and it said I was doing 68 mph.
The person that I was talking to said that with there being white lines on the road that it would have flashed me and also they would have had to do a secondary measurement of the vehicle against the lines???

Could this be true?

Pat

This continues from 68 in 60 zone.

You could ask for photos to aid driver identification - that will only work if the camera is a Truvelo (if used in front facing mode). Otherwise, or if Gatso: I think you will have to send off the signed NIP then ask for the photos, which you can used to confirm the corroboration.

Was the camera a Truvelo or a Gatso?

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Views expressed are personal opinions and are not necessarily shared by the Safe Speed campaign

It was one of those yellow boxes on a long pole with a small window in it, (a gatsto) I think.
It just astounds me as to how you are allowed 10% plus 2 which is 68 so I get a ticket?

If this the correct figuring out couldnt they have let it go?

Pat

That didn't really help

Was it a gatso, Truvelo or Redspeed? (click on links to view each type)


The thresholds vary, it's a bit of a lottery; bear in mind that speeding is an absolute offence (if it can be proven and corroborated that you were doing 60.1 in a 60 then technically you can be prosecuted).

You are not entitled to see any evidence prior to a not guilty plea at Court.

At this stage in the proceedings there is an alleged offence and the NIP/S.172 is seeking information. At this time, an S.172 is not an admission of guilt.

Some Forces will supply a copy of the photographs upon request 'to help identify the driver', regardless of the camera type - but they are under no obligation to do so.

Unfortunately that is something of a myth which helps the scammers, as

(1) Enforcement starts at a recorded speed of 10% + 2. You are not allowed that amount.

(2) That margin is partly there to allow for errors in the camera, the theory being that if there is an over-reading it will be the case that the speed limit was exceeded by some amount.

and

(3) They can enforce at a lower threshold if they feel like it anyway, subject to the limitations in point (2).

I am pretty sure from the links you have provided that it was a Gatso.

You also said "At this stage in the proceedings there is an alleged offence and the NIP/S.172 is seeking information. At this time, an S.172 is not an admission of guilt.

Surely when I return the nip with the details, that is it and they will just cash the cheque and return my licence with 3 points put on it???
Isnt that guilty?

Or am I missing something here?

Pat

You can say that you are the driver and you can also contest the speed, in which case you will (eventually) be entitled to any evidence to be used against you if taken to court.

edited to add:


In which case you should be given two photos and a time interval between them, such that you can go to site and confirm the secondary speed reading for yourself; however, the cheeky b@$%^£d SCPs have a habit on only sending out just the 1 photo (for gatso offences), this is unacceptable.

If the facts are that I was the driver but I really do not think that I was going this fast and could they please give more details or check this for me,
wouldnt this reply get their backs up and just put me in court anyway which would really bother me and worry me.
Do you think that they rely on people being too afraid and paying up.

I would be very scared of this going into court.

Pat

It won't get their backs up but they will make it appear that way, they may try to talk you out of fighting it.



However:



.....and with that I think I know what your chance of success in court really is. Good luck.

even in a 70 mph zone I did not think i waas doing this speed and there is no way I can check it,
(except for the speed camera)

Pat

Pat88,
You keep saying it was a 70mph zone...Just what do you mean by that?
Did it have one of these signs, and was it on a road similar to that in the picture or was it a Dual Carriageway...or a Motorway perhaps?
If it was a road a-la picture...the limit is 60 for a car...Motorways/dual carriageways =70 unless other signs are in evidence.
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Woa Everybody!

It's a REDSPEED, and it's in Charlatan country!! Limit is 60 - for a mile or so between two dual carriageway sections. Road is wide with good site lines, but has been prone to dangerous overtakes in the past.
It's a classic SCAMERA site.

You used to be able to view your photo's online but like the speed cameras attempts to reduce fatal and serious injury accidents, it is not working and they would appear to have given up on it!

You need to visit the CSCP website, and email them and ask to see the pictures.
If that does not work (they sometimes dont reply) contact the Central Ticket Office at Penrith.
While on the CSCP website, take a look at the statistics for accidents in Cumbria - already above LAST YEARS near record levels!

There will not be a time given between the pictures - and they might refuse to tell you if you ask, but the time is varied according to the primary speed reading, which means if you were exceeding the limit, there should be TEN divisions (metres) between the position of your vehicle in the first picture, and the second.

If you read the reports in the local press, you might think these cameras are unreliable.
The Salthouse Road (Barrow) camera was flashing all and sundry a while back, whether they were over the limit, and the Ings ones were the same in June last year, and again in November and December.

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Time to take responsibility for our actions.. and don't be afraid of speaking out!

Except there is no link between the speed limit and the trigger speed - they might have simply set them to capture everyone doing over 30mph, for example. Obviously they can't prosecute anyone doing < 60mph* but that doesn't stop them collecting a horde of photos.

* Except for the lesser limits for HGVs etc. Unless they set the trigger speed to 40mph to catch HGVs? Hmm...

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Andrew.

Was there not word that Redspeed cameras had a fatal flaw, and that all those in Charlatan County suffered from it?

Not that I have heard... I think you are thinking of the people that run them!

Or maybe you had read this

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Time to take responsibility for our actions.. and don't be afraid of speaking out!

What the heck does CSCP mean as I want to visit their site as mentioned by Ernest.

Thanks

Pat

I have just rang The Central Ticket Office who were very nice and polite and the lady there told me that I cannot access the photos by the internet but she looked for me and said that there were three photos to look at??
I have to e-mail them and get a copy and they will suspent the charge for 7 days presumably while I look at them!
Is there anything in these photos that can help me or not??

Thanks for your help

Pat

Cumbria Safety Camera Partnership, also know as Cumbria Casualty Reduction Partnership and now know as Cumbria Safety Cameras

I know Ernest will put me right if I'm wrong.

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Useless laws weaken necessary laws.

Correct! I didn't publish the URL, because I thought the OP might already have it!
They used to send out a leaflet with the NIP inviting you to look on the website! Maybe they are cutting costs by cutting back on their self publicising!

They should call it Cumbria "Safety" Cameras PLC, they would be oversubscribed by hopefull investors - people whose only interest is in profit and don't care how they make it!
Mind you shareholders would like to know exactly HOW they spent over £1 million earning £1.6 million in their first year of operations!!!

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Time to take responsibility for our actions.. and don't be afraid of speaking out!