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PostPosted: Tue Apr 20, 2010 23:21 
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I noticed that the HOSDB website carries the following disclaimer regarding FOI requests for Type Approval and Manufacturers documentation:

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Freedom of Information and Type Approval

The Home Office aims to ensure that the Type Approval process is open and transparent. All the above information is publicly available free of charge.

However, the detailed technical information supplied to HOSDB by speedmeter manufacturers is exempt from disclosure under sections 41 and 43(2) of the Freedom of Information Act 2000.

Section 41 of the FOI Act provides that information is exempt if the information was provided in confidence to the department and where its release could be considered an actionable breach of confidence. Section 43(2) of the FOI Act provides that information is exempt if 'its disclosure under this Act would, or would be likely to, prejudice the commercial interests of any person (including the public authority holding it).'

Section 43(2) of the FOI Act is a qualified exemption and therefore the prejudice test and the public interest test have to be applied. The Home Office has judged that it would prejudice the commercial interests of speedmeter manufacturers if the information supplied by them were to be released. We also have evidence that the disclosure of such information would make it less likely that companies, or individuals, would provide us with commercially sensitive information in the future, undermining the ability of the Home Office to fulfill its role in type approving speedmeter devices. Section 41 is an absolute exemption and the public interest test does not apply.


However I thought that this issue had been solved by the Information Commissioner's Office on the 11th of October 2007 [Case: FS50083358], where it was decided that neither of these Articles applied to the disclosure of the aforementioned information.

http://fuspy.com/UrlRedirector.aspx?u=-7062048242468486843&d=ico.gov.uk

Am I missing something? Can we get copies of Instruction Manuals for speed devices or not? :?


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 21, 2010 08:23 
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I can't see that an instruction manual would be a problem. I can see that the manufacturers would wish to keep their intellectual property commercially confidential.

Do you really just want the instructions or do you really want to know how any specific model works?

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 21, 2010 09:34 
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Just confused about the state of play really - if the Home Office have been told by the ICO that they have to release the details, why does their site tell you that they won't?

But yeah, if you've got the manual for a Gatsometer Type 24 + AUS lying around I'd love to read it.


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 21, 2010 18:33 
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malcolmw wrote:
I can see that the manufacturers would wish to keep their intellectual property commercially confidential.


"This here hazel twig can, using advanced dowsing technology, measure speed to within one inch per second - but the details are commercially confidential. So pay up and shut up" Which is a good parallel to the devices being used to "deteect" IEDs in Iraq

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 21, 2010 21:55 
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The point of type approval is to establish if the devices do work as intended and to reliably and repeatably comply to the specifications. It is not the purpose of type approval to establish the way in which the result is achieved.

Thus, the IP of the company is preserved but the device is shown to work. The IED detectors for Iraq must not have been properly tested to establish their efficacy. In fact, explaining the principle of operation to a gullible buyer might actually convince them that it would work and that no testing would be required.

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PostPosted: Wed Apr 21, 2010 22:09 
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can we stick to the point? thanks - the subject isn't type approval conditions nor is it IED detection or lack of


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 21, 2010 22:55 
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Well, your original thread title includes the words "type approval" and the first post is about protection of manufacturer's IP.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 22, 2010 03:39 
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Corbuzon wrote:
can we stick to the point? thanks - the subject isn't type approval conditions nor is it IED detection or lack of

Can we assume that you have been caught out by one of these machines, and hope to find a chink in their armour, or are you hoping to manufacture a rival product? :roll:

If I remember correctly, the Home Office bend the rules as and when desirable, as their only purpose is to ensure a conviction in the cheapest manner possible.
For instance HO specifies that the CONTACT POINT between the tyres and the road, has to be seen, and be able to be aligned with the white graduations on the road.. WRONG - in court, the magistrates will accept the word of the technician, when he says that at the office, they have a computer which shows where the vehicle is in relation to the road.
So you can see the Home Office say one thing and the court infers another and that is it.

Forget "Innocent until proved guilty" they would not take you to court if you were not guilty!

I can help you out with some old REDSPEED manuals, but the only GATSO manuals I had were old scans - not sure where they are now, but I think it was DIXIE who sent me them - and he now lives in Thailand and only frequents this forum occasionally in between posting on David Icke's website I believe!

This isn't helping much is it! :oops: Try Pepipoo for the manuals - they have all sorts of bods on there who would be keen to help if they can.

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 23, 2010 02:06 
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Thanks, but I haven't been caught by any cameras... just noticed the discrepancy whilst looking something up for someone else.

I wondered if, since the ICO judgement in 2007 there had been a further case that had a contradictory outcome.


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