Safe Speed Forums

[emphasis added]

So:

1. Any space - including any open space - may by secondary legislation be designated "smoke free"

2. Any person can be required by an "authorised officer" to provide "facilities, assistance or information", on pain of committing an offence that carries a fine of up to £1000 (level 3).

These are astonishingly wide-ranging and sweeping powers. In relation to the second, the power is much wider than s.172.

Of course, it is for our own good.

Who designate this - can landlords designate premises rented by smokers to be smoke free on arrival of tradesman ??

Perhaps it's a good thing that haddock and herring are dead - otherwise smoked fish and kippers might be a thing of the past

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lets bring sanity back to speed limits.
Drivers are like donkeys -they respond best to a carrot, not a stick .Road safety experts are like Asses - best kept covered up ,or sat on

Well, it does say "appropriate national authority" so probably not a landlord then.

I'm more worried about people who wish to remain disinterested bystanders now being required to assist the authorised officer. Failure is obstruction. Thus you can be forced to be a witness even if you don't want to.

"You will testify that your friend was smoking. You have no right to refuse."

This is wrong.

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Malcolm W.
The views expressed in this post are personal opinions and do not represent the views of Safespeed.

"appropriate national authority" - ah -missed that - but replace landlord with local council - was trying to be too general.

"Thus you can be forced to be a witness even if you don't want to." --unless you were looking other way

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lets bring sanity back to speed limits.
Drivers are like donkeys -they respond best to a carrot, not a stick .Road safety experts are like Asses - best kept covered up ,or sat on

We've already passed that!

Home smoke ban for council visits

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Views expressed are personal opinions and are not necessarily shared by the Safe Speed campaign

Actually, reading the article it isnt "quite" as bad as it sounds!

*I* would not wish to be "Obliged" to enter a smoky premeses as part of my job. The LA is simply stating that *unless* homeowners are willing to provide visiting officials with a smoke free enviroment they will have to go to the offices instead. It is *not* a "Smoking ban" as such, This doesnt seem too unreasonable to me.

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"The road to a police state is paved with public safety legislation"

But this puts extra onus on tenants - possibly negates tenancy conditions - wonder if i could hold out on a council official visiting my house because of my wife's wish to have a fag ,in the comfort of our home - not out at the back door---on the grounds that i was not prepared to be done/be responsible for any legal challenges /etc.

AH - LOVELY WEB THEY SPIN.

Now - how does this affect kipper smokers ? - they have to enter smoke laden premises to check on the fish ????

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lets bring sanity back to speed limits.
Drivers are like donkeys -they respond best to a carrot, not a stick .Road safety experts are like Asses - best kept covered up ,or sat on

Er, it doesn't chap. 'Smoke' only relates to tobacco smoke.....

1 Introduction

(1) This Chapter makes provision for the prohibition of smoking in certain premises, places and vehicles which are smoke-free by virtue of this Chapter.

(2) In this Chapter-

(a) "smoking" refers to smoking tobacco or anything which contains tobacco, or smoking any other substance, and
(b) smoking includes being in possession of lit tobacco or of anything lit which contains tobacco, or being in possession of any other lit substance in a form in which it could be smoked.
(3) In this Chapter, "smoke" and other related expressions are to be read in accordance with subsection (2).

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Political Correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical, liberal minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.

You sure about that?

I presume there is some further definition elsewhere in the regs as to what constitutes "smoking", as the fragment you posted leaves this incredibly vague and all-encompassing.

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CSCP Latin for beginners...
Ticketo ergo sum : I scam therefore I am!

I'm sure it doesn't refer to kipper smoking smoke.

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Political Correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical, liberal minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.

ah - but kipper smokers have to enter smoke laden premises - no sign of rp smoke - just "smoke " ,and as such - verboten

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lets bring sanity back to speed limits.
Drivers are like donkeys -they respond best to a carrot, not a stick .Road safety experts are like Asses - best kept covered up ,or sat on

Sure, but it mentions substances in a form that can be smoked. In the context of the surrounding text it seems fairly clear that smoked means' rolled up in paper and stuck in ones mouth'.
I'd be darned surpised if it meant kipper smoke, but not totally gob-smacked.

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Political Correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical, liberal minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.

Clearly the kipper thing is a silly example, but as read it nevertheless demonstrates that you can drive a metaphorical bus through the wording of this legislation.

I agree with you entirely about the context too, but unfortunately I know to my own personal cost how the laws in this land are not necessarily interpreted by our law lords in accordance with the intent or context of their drafting, but rather the exact wording will be stretched to fit whatever the expediency of the moment requires.

Or to put it another way, if they wanted (for whatever reason) to stop you from smoking kippers it would seem wide open for them to interpret this legislation to that effect and there'd be damn-all you could do about it, even (especially?) at High Court level!

...which seems to be a common theme running through practically every piece of legislation the current government drafts.

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CSCP Latin for beginners...
Ticketo ergo sum : I scam therefore I am!

You may like to read THIS to beat understand the system. The "law of the land" is not only open to interpretation, but the courts frequently need to interpret them differently to to the way they are written in order to enable the case to proceed.

No more smoking banana skins then

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Prepare to be Judged

Let us raise a glass, this Saturday evening, to the death of the Pub trade in this country. Most of those who have fought to pass this health-Nazi law never went in Pubs before and will not in future. Coupled with those of us who dropped in for a pint, a smoke and a chat after work, but will now just go home and they will stay away in their droves. Quote what you will about Eire and its thriving bar trade and I will quote Scotland, where bars are closing up daily.
In my town there is one of the best goldsmith's in the Country, licensed to work in all precious metals, he produces some of the most amazing custom jewellery that you will ever see. After Saturday no longer. He will not be permitted to smoke in his own premises and will have to walk away from his shop into the High Street to smoke, thus he has decided to call it a day after thirty years of making everything from the few simple commissions I have given him to making gold-and-platinum tank badges for the grandson of the Davidson half of Harley-Davidson.
He wears a tee-shirt that proclaims 'Passive Smoking Kills - But An AK47 Is Far More Satisfying!'
I can see where he's coming from...

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Aquila



Licat volare si super tergum aquila volat...

Don't forget "and lit". I have to say I'm (slightly) tempted to wander around various places, where I would never dream of smoking, with an unlit (or half-smoked but unlit) cigarette hanging from my mouth - just for the sport.

Haha!
Would it be possible to make something which looks like a cigarette but you can put some 'dry ice' (or similar) in to it to make it look "lit"?

I am assuming that this is classed as vapour rather than smoke. Steam would be more difficult...

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Andrew.

Or put in some form of receptical (PIPE) .Perhaps a way of making the smoke police get ballistic is to walk around with licorice pipes stuck in mouth.
Or evan walk around with empty pipes. And then if said pipe contained non tobacco subsatance ( not ileggal ) ---wouyld that be an offence ??Was thinking of herbal tobaco - such as honey and roses ( NO-not the names of the horses , although when i tried it ,i thought it was )

_________________
lets bring sanity back to speed limits.
Drivers are like donkeys -they respond best to a carrot, not a stick .Road safety experts are like Asses - best kept covered up ,or sat on

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Views expressed are personal opinions and are not necessarily shared by the Safe Speed campaign