Safe Speed Forums

I am not sure if C+ journalists browse here... but it's just lovely to see my tips appear in the mag this month

OK .. so there's a different slant in that the journalist // ironically Mr Pedoe (and those who frequent both sites will udnerstand my little "dig" here ( but nice to know he reads our little site but bases his pieces on a rather hippy looking professsor Dr Ian Walker of the local University of Bath - which incidentally is a good Uni.. I even contemplated studying in Bath.. but the night life of Manchester and what was then UMIST seemed a rather obvious choice for a then wannabe Physicist - who toyed with teaching and accountancy before giving in to genetic predisposition of police and .. er .. rather nice fast motor cars )

His piece is actually rather sensible



All the more reason to adopt a primary when necessary .. my dear chap. And BE SEEN .. you do do useful reviews of LIGHTS and other useful doo-dahs after all .. so why the hell do you not tell spinny to just use 'em instead of wasting space on your forum!

He says traffic lights and roundabouts are tricky areas.. well yes.. but then it is RED and AMBER for a REASON and - er . in this area .. we .. um .. prosecute anyone whether two wheeled, three wheeled or multi-wheeled if we cop 'em at it without any ./. - cough - discretion - cough I will say that the law is applied fairly and equally to all road users in that respect

But Mr Pedoe likes his cognitive pyschologists. Er .. Neil .. since you appear to lurk and your cognitive pyschologist basically says what Krissi as "NTC" posted .. and the Cycle Craft stuff and police notes from the courses offered to our own cycling team - I do wonder what your cognitive pyschologist does make of the general garbage which clutters the site. I have to mention this given the garbage we see via various links to that forum of yours This is no slight on you. Paul has a lot of nutcases on this site. Most ask me why we target drivers and not other criminals.. .... and I got mauled by one poster over some misconception of the police in the past. I hold my reasoned corner I state the case as it is for our officers at the sharp edge of life after all.



But let's look at this stuff

I am sure many on this board will have opinions anyway



Taken out of context .. and let's face facts.. the spindrifts of this world will do so .. and end up having the near misses

This type will not read (if he does buy the rag and I do not believe he does as He never ever comments on it being blunt here by the way. .. and not to fan flames.. but stating it as it is really )


Pedoe's piece attempts to clarify with




It's a bit like indicating after you have made the move and caused a near miss and upset to another road user



He goes on to say that there is a solution. and it is ./.. well not in so many words .. but it still


DA DA DARRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRGH!




C O A S T!!!!!!!!



Errrrrr! You have to concentrate, show courtesy, observe, anticipate and both PLAN, proact and perhaps at times react by giving sufficient space and time to this.

Look C+ . .. why do you just not admit it..

C O A ST is the key to safety.. and it does not matter if posted on this site by me.. on your site by Nice Tame Cat (and yep.. she's even fiercer than her younger sister .. Wildy ) or by any member of Familie Swiss on the internet.

The article still boils down to COAST skills regardless.

Pedoe even says eye contact is essential in his piece. Been saying that on here since the site started

Walker says



Err .. seek out one of my first posts from POLICE NOTES of at least 10 years ago .. and .. er.. I helped design that course .. errr .. and I wrote the very same thing back in October 2005 ON THIS SAFESPEED SITE .. as a person with very professional concerns over general know-how and safety on the part of ALL road users

Er.. do we get an apology over the inter-fora nonsense and garbage between C+ non-cyclists and all motorised vehicle user sites - now .. or shall I take this piece to be the "apology"

But what about riding position..

Walker claims he was given more room when riding in the gutter than in primary position.

He also claims to have been given less room when geared up with helmet and lycra as



Look.. primary position fine if you are riding with the flow. Secondary is about a metre from the kerb.

Our problem ..

We need to get all drivers more aware of why we adopt primary in certain instances for starts.. and to recognise that overtaking on a narrowish road even if the cyclist is in secondary is a bit of a more often than not.

Now .. on this .. we draw a case for making bikeabilty COMPULSORY for all. or at least all physically capable of riding a bike... and offer the theory to the rest

But it's still about C O A S T for all .. regardless and this piece concludes with something I or any of the Swiss could have penned






It is still despite their silly posting non cyclists on their site ..

1. C- oncentration on the road ahead
2. O-bservation - of signs, lollies, other road users, smells, parks, (why is that steel barrier near the play area?}
3. A-nticipation (based on all things observed, heard and smelled and making a plan of action by allowing
4. S-pace (giving sufficient room for maoeuvre and
5. T-ime to react.. time for the journey.. time to plan.. time to keep that 2 second minimum rule . and so on

But I have spelt this out before

But .. we said this in 2004 (were and still are subjected to severe malice by some non-cyclists with some perverted deep psychological problem) .. long before Walker published and now seized on by C+ ..



It's still riding and driving to COAST principles :wink;


Even negotiating with other road users.. a Paul Smith thread also introduced onto their forum.. added to and supported by Krissi and her husband at the time and yet attacked with malice by that handful of the rather apparent sub-standard road user


I do not post to fan any flames or start any wars .. but here you have the magazine publishing the same stuff posted on this site and by those posting to this and other motoring and road user interest sites.. who were not "trolling" but merely trying to make folk more safety aware

Prof Walker has in fact come to a similar conclusion posted over two years ago to C+ by Paul Smith as in his "negotiation" threads - and by Krissi (as Nice Tame Cat) as in her COAST thread




In short .. all the COAST stuff .. as posted by me and the Swiss riff raff as a family unit.

I am sure that the those silly people on C+ will no doubt show their stupidity on line..

But .. perhaps Jubs and B Cyclist might decide to reply with some courtesy on this site ..

If spindrift tries to respond .. then let him for once Paul I am sure his contribution will strenghten the need for COAST and prove him to be the non-cyclist everyone knows him to be

I am being blunter than normal.

I am delighted that C+ has this article which more or less supports COAST principles and proves me RIGHT

I just think that that handful of idiots who neither ride nor read the rag should hang their heads in shame

But that will be wishful thinking. But thank you C+ .. You posted the very same as the Swiss and safespeed

Article is on pages 23 -26 of this month's edition.


Read it.. worthy reference piece in any case.

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I got my mits on a copy to read this piece. I may even go buy to have this month's issue as a reference as it does have much of interest to me this month. I usually buy the mag once a quarter .. as I buy my car mags etc in a rotation.. and have a "sly browse in the newsagent at the rest

OK .. so per Dr Walker of Bath.. we have a similar piece of advice to that posted up on here by IG in October 2005, when IG kindly shared some notes from a police cycling course. So not new to suggest this.


The problem with some of his research is that a chunk of it is subjective .. based on his own experience on the road - coupled with a fairly low participant and perhaps not randomly selected from the vounteers who may have come forward - which does put his findings on the subject of "gear" and "motorist perception of cyclist capability" into some hard questionning.

When my older children passed their driving test.. nothing to warn another driver that these kids are novices. Sure.. we taught and trained them as best we could .. and we seem to be blessed with fairly steady young "adults" as well.

So .. I do not think so much "misconception of skills" .. but more the age old "misconception of what constitutes good manners and courtesy" out there





True. And as Mr Pedoe continues (posted it myself ages ago by the way from Cycle Craft pages) .. one metre from the kerb is the normal "secondary". Gives enough space for a car to pass on a wide road.. but on a narrow road .. They still squeeze past. This is when I go "primary" and always have done. Perhaps because I grew up riding on rural narrows anyway.. so it was more "instinctive survival" than formally taught
Perhaps

However, we use common sense and courtesy. Courtesy dictates to me that if I am towing something .. caravan, trailer containing one of my "harem" to a track session .. or even the horse (yep .. we keep horses for our kids and they do the odd show .. get the odd rossette .. ahhhh!) - then I am not going to be driving very fast and sometimes could hold up what's behind me. Courtesy (actually law where Wildy originates from) dictates that I pull in when safe and convenient and let them pass me. Same when I ride my bicycle if road is one where "primary" is safest place to be for me - but that does not mean I should not allow what's behind me not to overtake as soon as I reach a pull - in point to allow that.


Most of us do ride in "secondary" .. moving out to "primary" when our COAST skills alert us to "hazard" of pinch point ahead, roundabout, side street .. and this is surely the correct way of riding. Using the road alertly, thoughtfully .. to COAST principles as they do apply to ALL road users after all.

The photos in this piece showing the difference between the common "mistakes" and "good practice" are very useful.


The summary two inch says roughly what IG already posted in October 2005 when Paul introduced this section.





Sounds like .. um ... COAST to me We appear to have been on right track all the time with this

I do recall Paul Smith's "Negotiation with other road users" thread which he posted up on here, on PH, on C+ forum and one other site. There was only one forum which attacked the whole idea of COAST and Negotiation at the time. I will not spell it out . But let's just say same persons of the many thousand posts and a life in netty cyberspace and not in cars or on bicycles

.. a not so subtle dig on my part.

Oi.. we said before this Dr Walker chap




Sounds awfully like Paul's thread back in late 2004 on negotiation, taking responsiblility and control of a given situation to me It is somewhere on the archives on the fora ca. that period.

And in Dr Wlaker's "science" .. we are back to the old COAST and NEGOTIATION again

Not us saying this this time .. but Dr Walker and Mr Pedoe in CYCLING PLUS MAGAZINE! And yes.. IG posted all this ca October 2005 when this section opened.

Perhaps those doing all the shouting take issue with the faults in their cycling "expertise" being pointed out. After all, a petrolhead and cycle craft talk.. saying that cyclists will be in primary position for a reason..rather undermines their little world of angelic cyclists and demon drivers

Ahh... another not so subtle little dig at the morons in cyberspace



Indeed.

Bikeability and CTC trainers will teach and train all cyclists to do this. I suggest anyone thinking of returning to a bicycle, all parents and all existing cyclists out there.. would do themselves a big favour by reading this month's magazine in full, reading Cycle Craft and contacting the CTC for details of training near them. The trainers do do family and pal group sessions. We did one with our two young rogues .. who thoroughly enjoyed it and ride on the local roads safely, smoothly and confidently.


Have to say .. this month's rag has much of interest.. and nice to see Richard Peace of "Enjoy Your Bike" and author of many a cycle ride guide book - including the useful ones to the best watering holes recommending many rides . including a couple of our own faves in there. Done the Blackpoo! one with Willi and his silky pal He does shave those legs too for "speed.. speed.. speed.. "

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