Safe Speed Forums

I've recently had the following e-mail to my website from a lorry driver:


It is very worrying that this misinformation is being perpetuated by an official representative - it could lead to someone unwittingly getting points on their licence.

I have asked him if he is prepared to say in which area this was.

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"Show me someone who says that they have never exceeded a speed limit, and I'll show you a liar, or a menace." (Austin Williams - Director, Transport Research Group)

Any views expressed in this post are personal opinions and may not represent the views of Safe Speed

Sorry missed this before ... yes it is most worrying as it does create a confusing situation.
It gets worse too when reading this : http://metricviews.org.uk/2011/01/minis ... ed-limits/
(A bit old 07, but possibly still current?)
Stats here and the Free flowing speed here.
While on this subject van speed info is to be found here : http://www2.dft.gov.uk/pgr/roadsafety/s ... imits.html
and here: http://www.dft.gov.uk/topics/road-safet ... ed-limits/ (neigh stating the same!)
and ROSPA : http://www.rospa.com/roadsafety/advicea ... -hgvs.aspx
and
The Highway Code here: http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/TravelAndTr ... /DG_070304

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Safe Speed for Intelligent Road Safety through proper research, experience & guidance.

PM me the details and I will sort it.

Can anyone tell me what this means?

Does greenshed mean he can"fix" speeding offences ?
Where have I heard this before?
Oh yes! Blackburn in Lancashire!

"yimitier- step back, and take a few DEEP BREATHS.

I'm NOT A FAN OF GS, But. I'd suggest he's saying, not that he can sort out speeding offences( GS- MEMO TO YOU TO POST MORE CAREFULLY) ,but, that he'll look into the false info and get it corrected.
(Memo to GS- engage brain , before posting, might stop conflicts ensuing)

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lets bring sanity back to speed limits.
Drivers are like donkeys -they respond best to a carrot, not a stick .Road safety experts are like Asses - best kept covered up ,or sat on

Yes, to be fair to him, all he was saying is that he'd try to stop the dissemination of misleading information on speed awareness courses. Unfortunately my original correspondent didn't give the specific location, and didn't respond when I e-mailed him to ask, so I wasn't able to pass this on.

_________________
"Show me someone who says that they have never exceeded a speed limit, and I'll show you a liar, or a menace." (Austin Williams - Director, Transport Research Group)

Any views expressed in this post are personal opinions and may not represent the views of Safe Speed

I agree this is far from clear and much room for errors in spite of motorists taking care and paying attention and trying to be legal !
Definitely needs to be clarified AND widely published.
What does the HGV Haulage chaps say about it do you know? Is he just a one off who wasn't previously aware or is this a regular problem ?

Another point bothers me too ...
If a road speed setting is at the 85th%ile (assuming for a minute that this road is question is), yet his response from authorities is Then if they have used the 85th%ile then are they not saying that 'road users' do this so we say it is safe, but if road users are doing something different and it can be proven to be the case then should the authorities change their stance. After all it wasn't 'them' that set the speed for 'safety' it was what the public was doing in the first place that was simply deemed to be safe ... ?

_________________
Safe Speed for Intelligent Road Safety through proper research, experience & guidance.

I would say having hung around various websites and forums that it is a widespread misconception that a signed limit on a single carriageway road means HGVs can legally do 50. IMV the Highway Code should be clearer on this.

Also, although such roads are rare in rural locations, a four-lane single carriageway road is widely perceived to be a dual carriageway, which it isn't.

_________________
"Show me someone who says that they have never exceeded a speed limit, and I'll show you a liar, or a menace." (Austin Williams - Director, Transport Research Group)

Any views expressed in this post are personal opinions and may not represent the views of Safe Speed

Why do they need to be clearer ?
The maximum allowed [legal] speed limit of an hgv is 40mph on a single carriageway road.
End of.

_________________
The world runs on oil, period. No other substance can compete when it comes to energy density, flexibility, ease of handling, ease of transportation. If oil didn’t exist we would have to invent it.”

56 years after it was decided it was needed, the Bedford Bypass is nearing completion. The last single carriageway length of it.We have the most photogenic mayor though, always being photographed doing nothing

Yep - As said, I'm not one of GS's greatest fans, but to see his post twisted ,went against the grain. He meant to say ( to my reading) that if the info was posted up ,he'd look into getting the correct version published. Fair doos- Yimiter went for the jugular, without cause, and that was the reason for my post . At times GS goes over the top ,especially with folks new to the system ,but this time I thought he was spot on, so ,on this one occasion he's got my backing.

_________________
lets bring sanity back to speed limits.
Drivers are like donkeys -they respond best to a carrot, not a stick .Road safety experts are like Asses - best kept covered up ,or sat on

The thread has a single subject, that being the misinformation about vehicle dependent speed limits; only someone who had not read the information that preceded my comment could make the ridiculous accusation and interpretation made by the aggrieved poster from Lancashire.
Let's paraphrase:
1. On a speed awareness course an instructor gave some misleading information about speed limits
2. I said "Let me know where and I will fix that"

I note the comments of agreement but take issue with being told to "engage brain before posting" when someone with a vivid imagination and an agenda makes an unjustified and ignorant interpretation without reading and comprehending the text in the topic and has the mistaken belief I am someone from or who has been employed by the Lancashire partnership.

Well done for acknowledging my intent; perhaps you could take your unjustified remarks off the board at the same time.

As you will be aware ,the comment "Let me know where and I will fix that" could be taken many ways, as has been evidenced .I knew what you meant ,and without any malice to you took it as intended. My comment "engage..." ,could have been put more succinct,I admit, but the intent was to make you realise ,that those of us that know you knew what you meant, but others could use it against you. Perhaps the way you take my "engage...." is an example of that .If on this occasion I have offended you,it was done without any intent. You may note that I was one of the ones attempting to defend your honour by pointing out that you meant to stop any wrong info being given out, as against the other accusation of "fixing".

_________________
lets bring sanity back to speed limits.
Drivers are like donkeys -they respond best to a carrot, not a stick .Road safety experts are like Asses - best kept covered up ,or sat on

Which sections beyond those that I mentioned in my post here:
viewtopic.php?p=245981#p245981
did you need further info on ?

It seems that it is widely confusing and needs to be addressed on a big scale, both to all motorists so they know what speed HGV's are restricted to and obviously for the HGV to be completely clear as to what keeps them legal.
Full comprehension as to when and why the limits change, is necessary to as that helps with the predictability and knowledge of when they are likely to change.
I'd suggest a complete Campaign with full media coverage, leaflets, added notes from DVLA etc etc ... it is crucial that people know what their legal speed limit is. Certainly all speed awareness courses ought to be absolutely correct in their complete knowledge of all signs and most certainly all speed limits if they claim to be capable of 'tutoring' on the subject.
It is reasonable to try to rectify that problem.

_________________
Safe Speed for Intelligent Road Safety through proper research, experience & guidance.

I've been asked do I have any evidence of this!

This is a small example of how speeding offences were being "fixed" in Blackburn CTO in 2006- 2009 (Even whilst the IPCC were investigating "corruption within CTO" instigated through Nigel Evans M.P. & Jack Straw:


Conspiracy to pervert the course of justice



http://www.lancashiretelegraph.co.uk/ne ... ket_probe/







Section 172 Fixing



There is no facility to issue "A Warning" in relation to failing to name.

If this can happen for somebody who gets up the CTO's nose there is nothing to stop this being used for family & friends, colleagues etc.. etc.. at the Managers discretion.
HE DOESN'T HAVE THIS DISCRETION!

Just in case anybody doubts this:






These are genuine copies of an "official" speeding offence
(I have full permission to reproduce these as they stand only the name & address have been removed)

These documents were sent to Vern Coaker Minister in 2008 with a request to locate these on the National Database recording speeding offences.
He was unable to locate them.
Nothing happened about this offence. It was "fixed" by somebody in Blackburn CTO.

The IPCC investigation discovered that 60% of ALL returned NIPS "disappeared" or were "unfit for prosecution".



Let's not forget this guy and on... and on...,




Step back? O.K. There's a lot more & all reported in the Press!

I've just noticed this!!!!
Greenshed writes:


As this thread is about misinformation, it appears that greenshed is throwing a deliberate smokescreen in relation to Lancashire Partnership!

He knows that CTO is totally staffed by POLICE EMPLOYEES!

So can you now clarify were you experienced:
your quote:
!

You wouldn't experience that with "The Partnership"

Shame on you requesting that postings should be removed from this board! Just counter them with FACTS!

I think you could remove these:



I don't know about greensheds but "glasshouses" comes to mind in your case!

Please lets not turn this thread into a 'tit for tat' on previous nasty un-necessary comments. Some are highly un-necessary and far below the standard I'd prefer to see on these boards. Please try hard not to drop your posts to this derogatory level - anyone.

Interesting point about who owns the copyright on 'your' own image? The Crown will have a right over 'evidence' but can they really state that any reproduction is their copyright? I think that may well be wrong. If they take an image of my car and me in it, then if I wished to use that image on a forum to chat about it then I must have rights over that. A desire to understand the full legal ramifications of the alleged offence (& so not to waste the Courts time, of course, if upheld etc. etc) and also for direct copyright issues. Can the Crown own my image ?

The people involved in this failure to produce posting certificates (not sure that all forces are producing those) have now of course all been addressed along with punishments, albeit 'light'. How this proof of posting was not seen as essential in the first place only shows how incompetent the organising bodies are.
When their own staff are finding ways to 'trick' rewards from the system, this is perhaps not surprising given how immoral the whole greedy system is; i.e. it attracts like minded individuals.

If this becomes more involved I'll split the thread.
[edited]

_________________
Safe Speed for Intelligent Road Safety through proper research, experience & guidance.

As I understand it from involvement in photography forums, no, you have no rights to your image in the UK.

As one ,who might have been thought to be providing "nasty" comments, mine on "Engage " was a reminder to GS on how easy it is for those on both sides to take something the wrong way . I've already apologised to GS on this post,if he thinks I was in any way slanging him off, as a reminder of how easy it is for someone looking to discredit another's posts "GreenShed wrote:
PM me the details and I will sort it.
Like others who know GS -I took this to mean ,"give me the details ,and I'll make sure things are set right" . Not as others did ,and the evidence that they did is there . As I said, I'm not a fan of GS, but, let's be fair to the bloke.He does try ( at other times he can be trying ,sorry GS- THAT WAS MEANT AS A JOKE)
Problem with posting ,is that a lot of things can be taken a lot of ways, depending on the view of the reader .

_________________
lets bring sanity back to speed limits.
Drivers are like donkeys -they respond best to a carrot, not a stick .Road safety experts are like Asses - best kept covered up ,or sat on

... And hence why sticking (as much as possible) to facts and information, than "personal chatter", can help to prevent some clashes that often weren't really there, in the first place !

Homer - have you got links for the photography references please ?
If nothing was factually proven then I'll ask myself and try to obtain a decisive & clear answer.

_________________
Safe Speed for Intelligent Road Safety through proper research, experience & guidance.

I would love to know how Greenshed could fix anything, since he is not in anyway employed by any agency dealing with speed enforcement.

Perhaps he is going to write a stern letter to the enforcement authority involved, something that anyone could do!

Greenshed, please stop pretended to be an official, it is very boring now.