Safe Speed Forums

The campaign for genuine road safety
It is currently Tue Apr 28, 2026 21:36

All times are UTC [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 56 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3  Next
Author Message
PostPosted: Sun Nov 04, 2007 18:01 
Offline
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2004 06:46
Posts: 16903
Location: Safe Speed
http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/TravelAndTr ... /DG_069862

Quote:
[Motorways]

270 You MUST NOT stop on the carriageway, hard shoulder, slip road, central reservation or verge except in an emergency, or when told to do so by the police, HA traffic officers in uniform, an emergency sign or by flashing red light signals. Do not stop on the hard shoulder to either make or receive mobile phone calls.

[Laws MT(E&W)R regs 5A, 7, 9, 10 & 16,MT(S)R regs 6(1), 8, 9 & 14, PRA 2002 sect 41 & sched 5(8), & RTA 1988 sects 35 & 163 as amended by TMA 2004, sect 6]


And if the traffic ahead has stopped? :roll:

_________________
Paul Smith
Our scrap speed cameras petition got over 28,000 sigs
The Safe Speed campaign demands a return to intelligent road safety


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Nov 04, 2007 18:13 
Offline
Member
Member
User avatar

Joined: Sat Mar 20, 2004 09:59
Posts: 3544
Location: Shropshire
Arguably an emergency then isnt it? Because if you continue you are going to crash.

_________________
Political Correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical, liberal minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Nov 04, 2007 18:22 
Offline
User
User avatar

Joined: Sat Aug 13, 2005 23:28
Posts: 1940
Ach! I think they mean under normal fast flowing conditions.
:wink: Rare but they happen .. usually off peak und prone to speedy pickin's :roll:

Back on continent - they will prosecute for not driving at the speed limit when overtaking.

French motorways (recent engineering rolling programme :wink: also have an emergency area in case you cannot merge in on joining too.

_________________
Nicht ganz im Lot!
Ich setze mich immer wieder in die Nesseln! Der Mad Doc ist mein Mann! Und ich benutzte seinen PC!

UND OUR SMILEYS? Smile ... und the the world smiles with you.
Smiley guy seen when you read
Fine me for Safe Speed
(& other good causes..)

Greatest love & Greatest Achievements Require Greatest Risk
But if you lose the driving plan - don't lose the COAST lesson.
Me?
Je ne regrette rien
!


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Nov 04, 2007 18:23 
Offline
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2004 06:46
Posts: 16903
Location: Safe Speed
Rigpig wrote:
Arguably an emergency then isnt it? Because if you continue you are going to crash.


I did go round that loop before I posted.

But I think it stretches common sense to breaking point. No, it isn't a bloody emergency! It's just a traffic jam.

_________________
Paul Smith
Our scrap speed cameras petition got over 28,000 sigs
The Safe Speed campaign demands a return to intelligent road safety


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Nov 04, 2007 18:24 
Offline
User

Joined: Fri Mar 30, 2007 12:27
Posts: 361
It is why motorcycles filter in traffic jams.

They don't want to break the law. :wink:


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Nov 04, 2007 18:26 
Offline
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2004 06:46
Posts: 16903
Location: Safe Speed
Oh look.

We're not supposed to stop on slip roads either.

So when I come to the roundabout at the end of a slip road with a give way line and my route ahead is obstructed by approaching traffic, I'm not allowed to stop there either?

This lot have UTTERLY lost the plot.

_________________
Paul Smith
Our scrap speed cameras petition got over 28,000 sigs
The Safe Speed campaign demands a return to intelligent road safety


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Nov 04, 2007 18:27 
Offline
User
User avatar

Joined: Sat Aug 13, 2005 23:28
Posts: 1940
SafeSpeed wrote:
Rigpig wrote:
Arguably an emergency then isnt it? Because if you continue you are going to crash.


I did go round that loop before I posted.

But I think it stretches common sense to breaking point. No, it isn't a bloody emergency! It's just a traffic jam.


Usually caused by some muppet 30 miles ahead touching brakes to cause a wave-jam-wave.. :banghead: I think this linked to tailgating as well. :banghead:

Or accident ahead..

Or just plain rush hour peaks of volume :roll:

Or.. er roadworks :bunker: with the SPECS enforcing very low tempo limit :bunker:

_________________
Nicht ganz im Lot!
Ich setze mich immer wieder in die Nesseln! Der Mad Doc ist mein Mann! Und ich benutzte seinen PC!

UND OUR SMILEYS? Smile ... und the the world smiles with you.
Smiley guy seen when you read
Fine me for Safe Speed
(& other good causes..)

Greatest love & Greatest Achievements Require Greatest Risk
But if you lose the driving plan - don't lose the COAST lesson.
Me?
Je ne regrette rien
!


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Nov 04, 2007 18:31 
Offline
Member
Member
User avatar

Joined: Sat Mar 20, 2004 09:59
Posts: 3544
Location: Shropshire
SafeSpeed wrote:
Rigpig wrote:
Arguably an emergency then isnt it? Because if you continue you are going to crash.


I did go round that loop before I posted.

But I think it stretches common sense to breaking point. No, it isn't a bloody emergency! It's just a traffic jam.


So there is an exception to the rule which common sense dictates overrides the requirement of the HC.
Meh

_________________
Political Correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical, liberal minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Nov 04, 2007 18:34 
Offline
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2004 06:46
Posts: 16903
Location: Safe Speed
Rigpig wrote:
SafeSpeed wrote:
Rigpig wrote:
Arguably an emergency then isnt it? Because if you continue you are going to crash.


I did go round that loop before I posted.

But I think it stretches common sense to breaking point. No, it isn't a bloody emergency! It's just a traffic jam.


So there is an exception to the rule which common sense dictates overrides the requirement of the HC.
Meh


Yeah, but it's also a serious screw up. All rules are damaged by ill drafted rules.

_________________
Paul Smith
Our scrap speed cameras petition got over 28,000 sigs
The Safe Speed campaign demands a return to intelligent road safety


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Nov 04, 2007 18:35 
Offline
User
User avatar

Joined: Sat Aug 13, 2005 23:28
Posts: 1940
SafeSpeed wrote:
Oh look.

We're not supposed to stop on slip roads either.

So when I come to the roundabout at the end of a slip road with a give way line and my route ahead is obstructed by approaching traffic, I'm not allowed to stop there either?

This lot have UTTERLY lost the plot.


Ach! But at this point .. we did used to have "END OF MOTORWAY REGULATION" about 15 metres or so off.. along with RED "REDUCE SPEED NOW " signs.

But halt line mean give way to traffic already there. :wink:

I think they mean as you go down the ramp to join .. accelerating to merge neatly und safely into the existing flow. :wink: This was the old Rule 244 :wink:

I have had to re-read the Code as it was my "anoraky party piece" :rotfl: :bounce: to make everyone around throw up by being able to list the Rule und its number :rotfl:

_________________
Nicht ganz im Lot!
Ich setze mich immer wieder in die Nesseln! Der Mad Doc ist mein Mann! Und ich benutzte seinen PC!

UND OUR SMILEYS? Smile ... und the the world smiles with you.
Smiley guy seen when you read
Fine me for Safe Speed
(& other good causes..)

Greatest love & Greatest Achievements Require Greatest Risk
But if you lose the driving plan - don't lose the COAST lesson.
Me?
Je ne regrette rien
!


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Nov 04, 2007 18:46 
Offline
Member
Member
User avatar

Joined: Sat Mar 20, 2004 09:59
Posts: 3544
Location: Shropshire
Interesting you think 'they' have lost the plot over instances that are quite readily governable by common sense, yet are quite happy with this one....

130
Areas of white diagonal stripes or chevrons painted on the road. These are to separate traffic lanes or to protect traffic turning right.

If the area is bordered by a broken white line, you should not enter the area unless it is necessary and you can see that it is safe to do so.


Define 'necessary'. To overtake? Is overtaking ever necessary (genuine emergencies excepted) or just convenient?

_________________
Political Correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical, liberal minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Nov 04, 2007 18:52 
Offline
User

Joined: Fri Mar 30, 2007 12:27
Posts: 361
Rigpig wrote:
Define 'necessary'. To overtake? Is overtaking ever necessary (genuine emergencies excepted) or just convenient?

That has been in the HC for ages.

Broken white lines can be crossed. Solid can't. Doesn't matter about the hatching.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Nov 04, 2007 18:59 
Offline
Member
Member
User avatar

Joined: Sat Mar 20, 2004 09:59
Posts: 3544
Location: Shropshire
Icandoit wrote:
Rigpig wrote:
Define 'necessary'. To overtake? Is overtaking ever necessary (genuine emergencies excepted) or just convenient?

That has been in the HC for ages.

Broken white lines can be crossed. Solid can't. Doesn't matter about the hatching.


Sure, you know that! I've had this conversation with folks at work, and many think the hatching and lines means they can't, or shouldn't be used for overtaking.

_________________
Political Correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical, liberal minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Nov 04, 2007 19:01 
Offline
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2004 06:46
Posts: 16903
Location: Safe Speed
Rigpig wrote:
Interesting you think 'they' have lost the plot over instances that are quite readily governable by common sense, yet are quite happy with this one....

130
Areas of white diagonal stripes or chevrons painted on the road. These are to separate traffic lanes or to protect traffic turning right.

If the area is bordered by a broken white line, you should not enter the area unless it is necessary and you can see that it is safe to do so.


Define 'necessary'. To overtake? Is overtaking ever necessary (genuine emergencies excepted) or just convenient?


I'm more than happy with that rule. I actually think it's brilliant.

Shaded sections prevent a lot of risky overtaking near junctions by drivers who fail to appreciate the dangers.

But skilled drivers are free to exploit the tarmac after making full and appropriate safety checks. (With the sad exception of the possibility of debris).

As for the definition of 'necessary' that's part of the magic trick.

If I plan to overtake it is indeed on occasion necessary to drive over the shading.

_________________
Paul Smith
Our scrap speed cameras petition got over 28,000 sigs
The Safe Speed campaign demands a return to intelligent road safety


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Nov 04, 2007 19:04 
Offline
User

Joined: Fri Mar 30, 2007 12:27
Posts: 361
Rigpig wrote:
Icandoit wrote:
Broken white lines can be crossed. Solid can't. Doesn't matter about the hatching.

Sure, you know that! I've had this conversation with folks at work, and many think the hatching and lines means they can't, or shouldn't be used for overtaking.

That some of your workmates don't know the Highway Code doesn't surprise me. I suspect most drivers only have a vague idea of what is (and is not) in it these days.

You could ask them about passing on Zig-zag lines. I had a copper try to do me for that once on my bike.

I won. I was in the right and he was wrong. :lol:


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Nov 04, 2007 19:08 
Offline
Member
Member
User avatar

Joined: Sat Mar 20, 2004 09:59
Posts: 3544
Location: Shropshire
SafeSpeed wrote:
Rigpig wrote:
Interesting you think 'they' have lost the plot over instances that are quite readily governable by common sense, yet are quite happy with this one....

130
Areas of white diagonal stripes or chevrons painted on the road. These are to separate traffic lanes or to protect traffic turning right.

If the area is bordered by a broken white line, you should not enter the area unless it is necessary and you can see that it is safe to do so.


Define 'necessary'. To overtake? Is overtaking ever necessary (genuine emergencies excepted) or just convenient?


I'm more than happy with that rule. I actually think it's brilliant.

Shaded sections prevent a lot of risky overtaking near junctions by drivers who fail to appreciate the dangers.

But skilled drivers are free to exploit the tarmac after making full and appropriate safety checks. (With the sad exception of the possibility of debris).

As for the definition of 'necessary' that's part of the magic trick.

If I plan to overtake it is indeed on occasion necessary to drive over the shading.


So what do you say to drivers who interpret the 'necessary' as meaning the manouvre and not the actual driving on the hatching. What if someone (as I witnessed on Friday evening) is so convinced they shouldn't be used for overtaking they position their van into such a position as to compromise the safety of the overtaking vehicle? How does this help road safety?

And how can you not see that differing interpretations of this rule is far worse than having common sense override the demands of another.

Bizzare!

_________________
Political Correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical, liberal minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Nov 04, 2007 19:10 
Offline
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2004 06:46
Posts: 16903
Location: Safe Speed
Icandoit wrote:
Rigpig wrote:
Define 'necessary'. To overtake? Is overtaking ever necessary (genuine emergencies excepted) or just convenient?

That has been in the HC for ages.

Broken white lines can be crossed. Solid can't. Doesn't matter about the hatching.


I'm pretty sure that the solid line only has the force of law:

a) On motorways
b) When it is part of a recognisable double white line system with central cats eyes.

_________________
Paul Smith
Our scrap speed cameras petition got over 28,000 sigs
The Safe Speed campaign demands a return to intelligent road safety


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Nov 04, 2007 19:11 
Offline
Member
Member
User avatar

Joined: Sat Mar 20, 2004 09:59
Posts: 3544
Location: Shropshire
Icandoit wrote:
That some of your workmates don't know the Highway Code doesn't surprise me. I suspect most drivers only have a vague idea of what is (and is not) in it these days.


Yes, this is indeed an area of concern particularly where conflicts of understanding are likely to ocuur.
Where plain common sense will dictate our course of action is much less of a worry IMHO.

_________________
Political Correctness is a doctrine, fostered by a delusional, illogical, liberal minority and rabidly promoted by an unscrupulous mainstream media, which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Nov 04, 2007 19:16 
Offline
Site Admin
User avatar

Joined: Sat Mar 06, 2004 06:46
Posts: 16903
Location: Safe Speed
Rigpig wrote:
SafeSpeed wrote:
Rigpig wrote:
Interesting you think 'they' have lost the plot over instances that are quite readily governable by common sense, yet are quite happy with this one....

130
Areas of white diagonal stripes or chevrons painted on the road. These are to separate traffic lanes or to protect traffic turning right.

If the area is bordered by a broken white line, you should not enter the area unless it is necessary and you can see that it is safe to do so.


Define 'necessary'. To overtake? Is overtaking ever necessary (genuine emergencies excepted) or just convenient?


I'm more than happy with that rule. I actually think it's brilliant.

Shaded sections prevent a lot of risky overtaking near junctions by drivers who fail to appreciate the dangers.

But skilled drivers are free to exploit the tarmac after making full and appropriate safety checks. (With the sad exception of the possibility of debris).

As for the definition of 'necessary' that's part of the magic trick.

If I plan to overtake it is indeed on occasion necessary to drive over the shading.


So what do you say to drivers who interpret the 'necessary' as meaning the manouvre and not the actual driving on the hatching. What if someone (as I witnessed on Friday evening) is so convinced they shouldn't be used for overtaking they position their van into such a position as to compromise the safety of the overtaking vehicle? How does this help road safety?

And how can you not see that differing interpretations of this rule is far worse than having common sense override the demands of another.

Bizzare!


I've been exploiting the shading (when safe to do so) for a couple of decades. I have NEVER ONCE seen a problem arise.

The range of ability and experience on our roads is vast. Any rule that guides the 'lower skill groups' away from danger while leaving the higher skills groups free to make safe and appropriate decisions is brilliant in my book.

Now if we could pull off the same trick with speed limits...

_________________
Paul Smith
Our scrap speed cameras petition got over 28,000 sigs
The Safe Speed campaign demands a return to intelligent road safety


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Nov 04, 2007 19:28 
Offline
User

Joined: Fri Mar 30, 2007 12:27
Posts: 361
SafeSpeed wrote:
Icandoit wrote:
Broken white lines can be crossed. Solid can't. Doesn't matter about the hatching.

I'm pretty sure that the solid line only has the force of law:

a) On motorways
b) When it is part of a recognisable double white line system with central cats eyes.

See rule 130 of H/C.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 56 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3  Next

All times are UTC [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 131 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You can post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group
[ Time : 0.181s | 13 Queries | GZIP : Off ]