Safe Speed Forums

Consider the folowing hypothesis;

An employee at a garage is instructed to carry out a diagnostic road test (looking for an elusive noise or whatever) However, during this he is stopped by the police and it transpires that the vehicle has no tax or MOT.

What are the possible conequences for;

1) The driver (employee)
2) The employer

Furthemore, How can garages carry out these sort of tests in these circumstances without falling foul of the rules.

D

_________________
"The road to a police state is paved with public safety legislation"

The driver will be prosecuted. Driving a vehicle without displaying a current tax disc. Driving without an mot.
The owner will have to pay a fine for not having taxed the car.
They have things called "trade plates" to cover things like that....although there really isn't any excuse....since no valid tax isn't exactly hard to miss...

I know about "Trade Plates", but what about the MOT?

Even with them, How are un-MOTd cars to be prepared by a garage to take an MOT?

How is a non DIY owner to have (say) a previously SORNED vehicle prepared for being put back on the road! if he is liable for the garrages use of the vehicle?

What are the penalties for the driver?

What is the liability (if any) for the employer/supervisor who instructs the employee to take the test drive?

OTOH, Is this not a case of "Law for the hell of it"

There is Clearly no intent to "Use" an untaxed/un-MOT'd vehicle (in the way your average Chav would)

There is clearly no intent on the driver or the owner to "Evade" tax!

Prosecuting under these circumstances is not about "Clamping down on car crime" It is simply a case of "We will prosecute you because the Law says we can!" (And possibly, in addition, "Our Boss the chancelor needs all the money he can get!"

_________________
"The road to a police state is paved with public safety legislation"

I can't think of any reason for a mechanic to do that with an untested car, but they used to test the brakes on the road with a g-force meter before the rollers were invented!

I have a convertable car that has a total rebuild and the body has been off the chassis. The body is on leather spacers to the chassis. The car needs to be bedded down and the door alignments checked after a short trip to make sure they are not going to fly open.

_________________
Speed limit sign radio interview. TV Snap Unhappy
“It has never been the rule in this country – I hope it never will be - that suspected criminal offences must automatically be the subject of prosecution” He added that there should be a prosecution: “wherever it appears that the offence or the circumstances of its commission is or are of such a character that a prosecution in respect thereof is required in the public interest”
This approach has been endorsed by Attorney General ever since 1951. CPS Code

A vehicle which has no MOT or has failed an MOT can be driven to and from a place of testing by a direct route. However it can't be driven for any other purpose.

and it has to be booked in. i got stopped for driving a car with no tax. i explained that it was on its way for an MOT and they asked to follow me. obviously i agreed and on arrival at the garage, the boss came out and asked me why i was late. they officers said it was their fault and left. no problem

_________________
Richie

SSAFA supporter
http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=126025031585

If the garage is required to road test a vehicle then they can do so using "Trade Plates" this only tells the authorities that a) the vehicle is "INSURED" by the company who are registered keepers of the trade plates (3rd party only) i.e. the garage, but it does also mean that the vehicle should be in a "Roadworthy" condition also if you wish to take a vehicle for repair or MOT you can drive a vehicle to a "place of repair" (i.e. a "Bonafide Garage") for repairs but it must be roadworthy, i.e. tyres legal and lights working and more importantly "INSURED" for a minimum third party cover but not taxed!
You could still be prosecuted for not displaying tax though !

Trade plates when used only tell the police etc. that the vehicle concerned is "Insured" and not necessarily roadworthy so it is up to the driver to decide whether to risk an unroadworthy car or not on the road and the "ULTIMATE" responsibility is on the driver not the garage !

Quite.
But one assumes that the EMPLOYER has some form of insurance for the staff when driving a customers vehicle on test ?
One also assumes that the staff are not so thick that they cannot protect themselves against prosecution ?. It is, after all, a rather well-known fact that to keep and/or use a motor vehicle on the public highway it must be displaying a current excise licence. The vehicle must also be roadworthy....which does not necessarily mean it has to be mot'ed.
So.
No road tax. Employee prosecution.
No mot. Employee prosecution.
No insurance. Employee prosecution.
Did the employer know of all these possible offences ?
Yes ?
Employer prosecution as well.

You can't use the rollers with permanent four-wheel drive, limited slip differentials, and some others.

http://www.ukmot.com/3-7.asp

HTH,

_________________
Will

That's odd... I've had quite a few LSD equipped vehicles and they have always tested the brakes on the rollers.

I'm also at something of a loss to explain why or when it would actually matter (not that I know much about the brake testing machines).

_________________
Paul Smith
Our scrap speed cameras petition got over 28,000 sigs
The Safe Speed campaign demands a return to intelligent road safety

AFAICT (but I'm no expert), just as it transfers drive, LSD can transfer braking effort across the axle, which can result in false readings.

_________________
Will

As I said in the first message that "Trade Plates" only show that the vehicle displaying them is insured by the registered keeper of the plates which only covers (in most cases) the vehicle for the minimum of cover i.e. 3rd party only, the responsibility for the roadworthyness of the vehicle rests with the DRIVER and not the employer as the driver has the right to refuse to take out on the road an unroadworthy vehicle and should a prosecution notice be issued then the company as well as the driver could be prosecuted for aiding and abetting an offence.

There is nothing in the law that stipulates how far away the testing station is. Legally, it can be at the other end of the country.

That may well be taking the p*ss, but it's legal

You could be required to prove that it was being driven soley for that purpose.

As I understood it you must be going to the nearest MOT station. You might get away with a claim that the nature of your vehicle demands passing several others to get to the one you booked into - a mates US motorhome is currently in Birmingham for repair and MOT and he lives in Manchester! But on the whole it should go to one near to the registered address.

Barkstar

_________________
The difference between intelligence and stupidity is that intelligence has limits.

The legislation doesn't, AFAIK, specify the nearest MoT garage. In fact, you could have a car in Manchester, book a test in London, and drive it there quite legally, so long as the test was pre-booked.

nope. in my case, i had recently moved from andover to salisbury but kept going back to the same garage. i wouldnt like to guess how many MOT centres would have been closer but the officers had no problem. they didnt even check the bookings. the fact that the boss came out and asked why i was late was enough for them and they were on their way

_________________
Richie

SSAFA supporter
http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=126025031585

Some stations can, some can't. It is a question of having 4 wheel (or more accurately 2 axle) rollers instead of a single pair used to test one axle at a time.

LSD is irrelevant, since an LSD is only effective when being driven by the propshaft