Safe Speed Forums

If by "genuinely rigourous enforcement" you mean "prosecute every single transgression", this may be reductio ad absurdam but I'd venture to suggest that, humans being fallible creatures, more than 50% of the driving population would have racked-up enough hits to lose their licences before the first NIP came through the letterbox!

Mind you, you may well get what you wish for... "Galileo" has to be paid for somehow.

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"Politicians are the same the world over... We build bridges where there aren't any rivers." - Nikita Kruschev

Ah yes, I assume you mean this Jeff?

"The Galileo satellite navigation system will soon become a reality after being given final approval in Brussels. "

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/4085651.stm

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The views expressed in this post are personal opinions and do not necessarily represent the views of Safe Speed.
You will be branded a threat to society by going over a speed limit where it is safe to do so, and suffer the consequences of your actions in a way criminals do not, more so than someone who is a real threat to our society.

I've already said what I mean by "genuinely rigourous enforcement", and additionally you should see what I said to Tone about (a) changing to rigourous enforcement instantly and (b) about what leeway I think should be given.

Now there's something you should have found out about first. From the article:

This will cost 2.1 billion euros (£1.4bn), with industry putting up two-thirds of the investment. More than a billion euros has already been released for research and development. Further funds will need to be approved to pay for the first years of operations.

Eventually, however, it is expected the running costs will be entirely covered by the private sector.

To add something as a general reply to a few posters:

I think that if people can't stay within the speed limit then they either don't have the ability to properly control their vehicle, or they can't control themselves; they can't contain their 'urges'. The latter point is backed up by the fact that the vast majority of people on this site are men.

You may be right. You may also find that many, myself included, have a clean driving licence - so far.

But on almost a weekly basis I am hearing of ever more people being prosecuted. Not just people in my profession. Not maniacs or terrorists or murderers...


http://www.safespeed.org.uk/forum/viewt ... 352#169352

...but regular decent folk whom we all rely upon, including yourself. People who have had a safe impecable driving history! (That should tell you something!)


BTW. I'm not including you in gf's viewpoint. After some initial bad feeling towards you, I actually think your are quite genuine and passionate about how you feel and I respect you for that, even though I vehemently disagree with you. Different viewpoints have always been welcome here, to dear Paul's great credit.

gf is a thouroughbred troll, through and through and no-one here takes him seriously and, I suspect, nor does anyone else accept family friends and fools.

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The views expressed in this post are personal opinions and do not necessarily represent the views of Safe Speed.
You will be branded a threat to society by going over a speed limit where it is safe to do so, and suffer the consequences of your actions in a way criminals do not, more so than someone who is a real threat to our society.

Bad news.
The costs are going to be carried by the EU taxpayer. Since "private industry" can get all the gps services it wants from the US system, they feel that the sharholders won't like paying for something they can get for free. The other "private industries" are the various transport industries that will benefit from road charging.
Oh, the "EU agricultural budget" is being raided for funds. A decision taken without benefit of democracy, by those unelected and unaccountable.


And the costs have been dramatically under-estimated.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/7087941.stm

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/01/28/galileo_satnav_uk_gov_admits_its_powerless/

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/business/news/galileo-an-orbiting-railtrack-say-mps-400046.html

The private companies seem to be state (EU) funded companies, and they are not exactly interested in paying.

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The world runs on oil, period. No other substance can compete when it comes to energy density, flexibility, ease of handling, ease of transportation. If oil didn’t exist we would have to invent it.”

56 years after it was decided it was needed, the Bedford Bypass is nearing completion. The last single carriageway length of it.We have the most photogenic mayor though, always being photographed doing nothing

Oh no! All drivers who break the speed limit are potential rapists!

What a load of old drivel hjegn, you're getting desperate! Control your trolling urges!

It's no good coming out with a strawman to try and win the argument, is it or is it not the case that the vast majority of people on this site moaning about speed limits are men?



For someone who has put "hjegn", I would suggest that you need to control your own trolling urges.

And sorry to blow your 'argument', but I don't have any trolling urges; I am just coming out with a perfectly reasonable viewpoint.

Is it not the case that the vast majority of people posting on any automotive forum, or indeed any forum relating to a technical subject, are men?

Try a bus enthusiasts' forum - is it sinister that virtually all of them are men?

I can think of at least four prolific female posters on this forum - and don't forget the leader of the Safe Speed campaign is female too.

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"Show me someone who says that they have never exceeded a speed limit, and I'll show you a liar, or a menace." (Austin Williams - Director, Transport Research Group)

Any views expressed in this post are personal opinions and may not represent the views of Safe Speed

Oh hold on, looking back through the thread I now realise that we've spoken before Johnnytheboy! Yes, that's right, you completely dodged this post of mine I believe:

I have no idea, but why do you feel it is relevant?

Are you male or female? I'm male. Does that make my opinion on road safety less valid somehow? How does that work? That's like saying a forum like mumsnet can't be considered to offer a balanced set of opinions on childcare, because most of the participants are female.



1. Remind me WHY you have re-registered as hjeg2, please? Or are you a different person? I'm not playing games, I genuinely can't remember, but it seems very fishy.
2. I would suggest that it is broadly accepted that it it is hard to troll a forum by posting in general agreement with said forum's stated views.
3. I would suggest that you have posted here in the certain knowledge that your views are not likely to be well received, but that you've persisted long after your point has been made ad nauseum, which in the balance of things makes you far more likely to be considered - by a dispassionate observer - a troll, than me.

You have a point, that may well be true. But I had thought of a different point/question: what percentage of fatal and serious collisions had men at the wheel? 75%? 90%? Higher? How many speeding offences were by men?



But that doesn't go against what I was saying; how many prolific male posters could you think of if you spent the time? As for the leader of the Safe Speed campaign, isn't she just leader because of very unfortunate circumstances?

Ok, what proportion of miles driven are by men.

And what's your point? That men shouldn't be allowed to drive? What are you (if you'll excuse the pun) driving at?

Here's are different questions: what percentage of fatal and serious collisions had men at the wheel? 75%? 90%? Higher? How many speeding offences were by men?



WHY does it seem very fishy? Why does it bother you? I forgot the password for hjeg and didn't want people coming out with the stupid line that I was someone else (as if it makes any difference).



But 'trolling a forum' is not what we are talking about here, so don't waste your time with strawmen.



I would suggest that you are wrong. And what would you say my point is?



Only in your opinion, not in mine. I'm still waiting for your final definition of what a troll actually is.

Firstly, I'm still waiting for you to reply to this post of mine: Thu Jan 31, 2008 6:59 pm



I don't know, do you?



My point is that it is basically being claimed that it is almost impossible to stay within the speed limit but that that is complete rubbish as it is generally only men who say so (whether on here or in the wider world). They are just trying to find an excuse for the fact that they can't control themselves. My point is simply that I don't buy the argument that you can't stay within the limit. So obviously if men do end up being banned then I have no sympathy.

Fair enough - that's a good explanation! Enough with the 'n' thing already....



I am! What kind of trolling are you talking about?



Something along the lines of any man (women apparently being exempt from criticism for some reason) that breaks the speed limit by even 1mph is a baby-killing rapist-in-waiting.



Wikipedia says "An Internet troll, or simply troll in Internet slang, is someone who posts controversial messages in an online community, such as an online discussion forum, with the intention of baiting other users into an emotional response." That's as good a definition as any.

In regards to the next point about answering your question from before (which I'd figure out how to paste in to this post, but my bath's running and I hate sequential post by the same person, it looks a bit rabid):

I don't know how many KSIs had men at the wheel, but my response was that without adjusting for the fact that men drive more miles than women, the raw statistic is meaningless. And anyway, what's it matter? You're trying to say men = speeders = accidents, when given that the DfT's figures tell us that 96% of accidents are not caused by exceeding the speed limit, this is, as you would say, a "strawman".

Now enough of the C+ style "answer the question!" posting as I'm fairly sure I've asked as many questions without response as you have.

And it's bath time, then pub time!

It is often considered trolling if irrelevant posts are slipped into threads to derail them and take them off topic.

Just thought I'd mention that point.

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www.thatsnews.org.uk / www.thatsnews.blogspot.com / http://thatsmotoring.blogspot.com/

I think we're getting close to sexism here, lets be careful folks, stick to facts.

To think that clearly shows that you haven't been reading my posts properly, as I have never said anything like that. Can you suggest even a single post of mine that says the above? You are doing the right-wing thing of taking a black-and-white attitude; anyone who disagrees with you must somehow have the complete opposite viewpoint. The really stupid thing is that on THIS thread in a post to Tone I said that I didn't think the above.

I shall come back to the rest later.