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PostPosted: Thu Jun 26, 2014 07:41 
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Big Tone wrote:
To my mind the example of what you may see in India is very bad, yet the much more minor infringement in Switzerland is regarded as extremely bad. But they are the laws, as they currently stand, for said respective country. (Which is what I said).


Yup, sorry, got you wrong there. Thought you were saying that it is was OK for the law in India to be how it is.

Having said that I'm not sure it's legal for them to do what they do. Certainly it's law to wear a helmet in India and very very few do. The Police come out occasionally and fine everybody for not wearing a helmet, but the consensus is that the money goes straight to their pockets and the fine is seen as a payment for not wearing a helmet, which frankly I'm not sure I would given the heat out there in some parts!


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 26, 2014 08:46 
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weepej wrote:
Yup, sorry, got you wrong there. Thought you were saying that it is was OK for the law in India to be how it is.
No prob Weep. They do seem to have a complete disregard for safety and indeed life itself when it comes to staying safe. (Images in my head of people hanging off the outside of a moving train :shock: ). We, on the other hand, have arguably gone to the other extreme and down the American route of “where’s there’s blame there’s a claim” which also bothers me. (Separate topic).

weepej wrote:
The Police come out occasionally and fine everybody for not wearing a helmet, but the consensus is that the money goes straight to their pockets and the fine is seen as a payment for not wearing a helmet, which frankly I'm not sure I would given the heat out there in some parts!
So not that different to over here then eh? :wink: Let’s put a scamera up where it’ll make more money rather than teach idiotic drivers to drive safely...

I’m getting ever more irked lately at drivers going at silly speeds down side roads TBH. I’m going to write to Birmingham City Council to see if I can get my road’s name changed to Santa Pod. :furious:

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You will be branded a threat to society by going over a speed limit where it is safe to do so, and suffer the consequences of your actions in a way criminals do not, more so than someone who is a real threat to our society.


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 26, 2014 14:16 
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Quote:
which frankly I'm not sure I would given the heat out there in some parts!


Wow, did I read that correctly?

Weepy admits to breaking the law AND causing un=necessary danger to himself...... :o

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My views do not represent Safespeed but those of a driver who has driven for 39 yrs, in all conditions, at all times of the day & night on every type of road and covered well over a million miles, so knows a bit about what makes for safety on the road,what is really dangerous and needs to be observed when driving and quite frankly, the speedo is way down on my list of things to observe to negotiate Britain's roads safely, but I don't expect some fool who sits behind a desk all day to appreciate that.


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PostPosted: Thu Jun 26, 2014 20:19 
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graball wrote:
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which frankly I'm not sure I would given the heat out there in some parts!


Wow, did I read that correctly?

Weepy admits to breaking the law AND causing un=necessary danger to himself...... :o


try again.. you clearly read it deliberately incorrectly.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 27, 2014 09:04 
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Quote:
and the fine is seen as a payment for not wearing a helmet, which frankly I'm not sure I would given the heat out there in some parts!


Still reads to me as "I'm not sure I would wear a helmet out there, given the heat in some parts", but maybe weepy will be along soon to clarify?

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My views do not represent Safespeed but those of a driver who has driven for 39 yrs, in all conditions, at all times of the day & night on every type of road and covered well over a million miles, so knows a bit about what makes for safety on the road,what is really dangerous and needs to be observed when driving and quite frankly, the speedo is way down on my list of things to observe to negotiate Britain's roads safely, but I don't expect some fool who sits behind a desk all day to appreciate that.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 27, 2014 15:11 
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graball wrote:
Quote:
and the fine is seen as a payment for not wearing a helmet, which frankly I'm not sure I would given the heat out there in some parts!


Still reads to me as "I'm not sure I would wear a helmet out there, given the heat in some parts", but maybe weepy will be along soon to clarify?


Still doesn't seem likely that he's been to india AND ridden a motorbike without a helmet.... which would be the only way in this context he would have actually broken any law as implied...


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 27, 2014 16:00 
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It makes sense to wear something on the one part of your body which if hit will cause untold and sometimes permanent damage. I wouldn’t use a hot climate as a reason not to wear one because I need something covering my bald head anyway. The vents on a cycle helmet are pretty good; some better than others. I’m also glad to see motorcycle helmets have followed suit. Long ago, when I were a lad, the only venting was if you wore an open face loose-fitting helmet.

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You will be branded a threat to society by going over a speed limit where it is safe to do so, and suffer the consequences of your actions in a way criminals do not, more so than someone who is a real threat to our society.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 27, 2014 18:03 
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Quote:
which would be the only way in this context he would have actually broken any law as implied...


Ah, being pedantic, I understand now.

In weepie's head, admitting to conspiring or considering, to break the law, is usually enough to warrant an arrest or a spike through the brain, surely?

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My views do not represent Safespeed but those of a driver who has driven for 39 yrs, in all conditions, at all times of the day & night on every type of road and covered well over a million miles, so knows a bit about what makes for safety on the road,what is really dangerous and needs to be observed when driving and quite frankly, the speedo is way down on my list of things to observe to negotiate Britain's roads safely, but I don't expect some fool who sits behind a desk all day to appreciate that.


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 01, 2014 21:25 
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Mole wrote:
Just as an aside (sorry for the thread drift) does anyone have any accurate figures for stopping distance in the dry from (say) 20 or 30 MPH for a pushbike? An "average" road one would be nice, but just to get us in the ball park, any pushbike at all, with any kind of brakes. Just curious.


And tonight's quick test concludes that i need a better data logger (or at least to turn smart logging off).

Road bike, standard brakes/pads on alloy rims. Dry smooth tarmac.
At limits of rear wheel locking.

Stop 1: 7.96mph to 0, 3seconds = 1.18 m/s/s = 5.3m
Stop 2: 8.65mph to 0, 6seconds = 0.64 m/s/s = 11.598m

Instantaneous speed at start of stop was faster, but not recorded so taken first point during the stop. Second stop was definitely longer distance but not as much as half the rate / twice the distance!

Best I can do on this device is 1sec log interval. Wonder if the vbox from work will run off a few AA batteries :lol:


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 01, 2014 22:16 
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Ed- once you've got the dry data ,try a wet version. Lots of years, old bike, but in my experience brake blocks on metal rims don't like the wet. :shock:

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 02, 2014 08:04 
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botach wrote:
Ed- once you've got the dry data ,try a wet version. Lots of years, old bike, but in my experience brake blocks on metal rims don't like the wet. :shock:


Depends on the aim of the exercise really.... car stopping distances are quoted in the dry right ?
And manufacturers / tyre company performance figures are all super optimised conditions.

Plus I'm alot less likely to go out & piss about with braking distances if it's wet :wink:


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 02, 2014 20:11 
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Car distances usually add the rider ( no pun intended) about doubling the distance in the wet , possibly from the olden days of drum brakes all round, (where on certain roads it was good practice to keep tabs on the brakes ,and apply them regularly to keep them dry) but I'd say quadruple on a bike in the wet. My interest was purely scientific, to see if bike brakes have improved over the years.

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 11, 2014 01:09 
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Mole wrote:
Just as an aside (sorry for the thread drift) does anyone have any accurate figures for stopping distance in the dry from (say) 20 or 30 MPH for a pushbike? An "average" road one would be nice, but just to get us in the ball park, any pushbike at all, with any kind of brakes. Just curious.

Most interesting question. :)
Perhaps worthy of it's own thread too !
First the disc brakes work faster than the rim braking systems and even then there are the variable pull type again side pulls that vary too. Then of course rubber and wear on all systems - most interesting.
http://forum.ctc.org.uk/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=5535
http://forum.ctc.org.uk/viewtopic.php?p ... ght=#34666

Edited to add the links :
http://www.eng-tips.com/viewthread.cfm?qid=74375 :)
http://forums.bicycling.com/topic/54635607125087665
http://www.cyclebanter.com/showthread.php?t=210880
https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic ... rEXFrWD2XE
includes and interesting list :
Bike type
Brake type
Pad type
Pad condition
Cable or hydraulic
Rim type
Rim condition
Tyre type
Tyre size
Tyre pressure
Tyre condition
Brake Levers
Riding position
Rider weight
Road conditions
Gradient
Wind vector
Helmet or no helmet

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 11, 2014 01:28 
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weepej wrote:
SafeSpeedv2 wrote:
Should peds wear helmets in case of an accident

I'm sure Ive posted this before.
If anybody should wear helmets, it's people driving cars...
My comment was to demonstrate how un-neccessary people would view the need to wear a helmet all the time as the risk would be perceived to be small.
It's always about a variety of risk management balances vs actual injury risk (inc type of severity of accident).
Big Tone is quite right too in stating that each Country has a different perception of danger and so a different angle on how to reduce risk and injury.

dcbwhaley wrote:
E question to which I cannot get an answer is: why do we single out two wheel road users as being negligent for nit wearing helmets when it is clear that the entire population would be safer if they wore helmets?
Not all of us are singling out cyclists as being negligent fro not wearing helmets. It is a personal choice and responsibility when one quite might decide to wear a helmet. This is correct. Anyone can choose to wear what we like. Perhaps it may show up in the Stats that those who have home accidents and wear religious clothing like turbans may have less sever injuries or none at all, although by that very nature it will prove difficult to prove as you'd need the accidents to compare it with.

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 11, 2014 21:31 
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Possibly today I had an answer, but not one the cycling lobby would like. We have a street that recently has been converted into a :20: zone. Off a side street, I noticed a cyclist, approaching traffic with a degree of aggression. He then rode across a line of approaching cars ( in an aggressive manner), to merge into the traffic. Some drivers saw his approach to cycle down the gap between kerb and vehicle as dangerous, so idiot decided that he'd power drive pedestrians on the pavement. He then came back on the road, behind a taxi ,then weaving dangerously in front. Taxi sounded horn to make him aware, response was figure rampant. I passed idiot on road, and made him aware of my presence using horn. Answer was a another lot of abuse in foul language. I'd suggest that no helmets are needed.

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PostPosted: Sat Jul 12, 2014 18:31 
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botach wrote:
Possibly today I had an answer, but not one the cycling lobby would like. We have a street that recently has been converted into a :20: zone. Off a side street, I noticed a cyclist, approaching traffic with a degree of aggression. He then rode across a line of approaching cars ( in an aggressive manner), to merge into the traffic. Some drivers saw his approach to cycle down the gap between kerb and vehicle as dangerous, so idiot decided that he'd power drive pedestrians on the pavement. He then came back on the road, behind a taxi ,then weaving dangerously in front. Taxi sounded horn to make him aware, response was figure rampant. I passed idiot on road, and made him aware of my presence using horn. Answer was a another lot of abuse in foul language. I'd suggest that no helmets are needed.



Botach discovers that there are complete tossers out there on bikes as well as in cars (and on foot)....


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PostPosted: Sat Jul 12, 2014 23:10 
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weepej wrote:

Botach discovers that there are complete tossers out there on bikes .


Something I've long said(and known from observation), but you've long said don't exist( Perhaps you cycle with blinkers on to the ils of the cycle fraternity- as in Cycling farm ,where two wheels are good and anymore are bad). Perhaps after this long awaited admission, we should expect a blizzard or an apology to all those folks you've accused of being anti cyclists , and as a bonus , a reply to some of the questions you so conveniently manage to ignore.

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 13, 2014 09:16 
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botach wrote:
weepej wrote:

Botach discovers that there are complete tossers out there on bikes .


Something I've long said(and known from observation), but you've long said don't exist( Perhaps you cycle with blinkers on to the ils of the cycle fraternity- as in Cycling farm ,where two wheels are good and anymore are bad). Perhaps after this long awaited admission, we should expect a blizzard or an apology to all those folks you've accused of being anti cyclists , and as a bonus , a reply to some of the questions you so conveniently manage to ignore.


I've never said that, it's all in your imagination I'm afraid!

Long awaited admission?

What questions have I ever ignored? I've asked this before, you've never come up with an example.


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 13, 2014 20:32 
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Sadly I see more and more old time posters not posting- could it be they are fed up with the cycle warrior, who thinks those on two wheels can do no wrong. Now lets go back to my last example.
The last post I made, concerned one cycle warrior, who had decided that he's cut through a narrow two lane road on any side possible. He couldn't break into a natural gap, so forced into a small gap between cars ,and then shot onto the pavement on the nearside. He then forced his way onto the road and overtook ,on wrong side ,several cars, returning to the nearside behind a taxi, to cut up taxi and cycle down the wrong side. The taxi driver sounded a warning to get fingers rampant. Cyclist then crossed junction on green light and hogged thre centre of a lane till it became a two lane road. Several of us passed him, making him aware of our presence using the horn. He caught up with all of us at a pedestrian crossing, which he crossed on red, mouthing obscenities at the cars stopped.
Come on then Weepy - lets have a breakdown of what offences he'd committed( IF YOU CAN SEE ANY )
( apart from being a Kami kazi cycle warrior).
Perhaps you might like to reflect on James 1 of UK attitude to the divine right. He lost his head, cyclists with this attitude usually end up in
1) wheel chair
2) Coffin
3) Severe dependency ward in some high tech hospital. No doubt Big TONE can give us figures.
IMHO, this bloke demonstrates the need registration etc of cycles and COMPULSORY third party insurance for cyclists. Had cyclist been faced with a learner or inexperienced driver( when cyclist was on wrong side of road), there could have been nasty and possibly serious consequences. Fir example- where I'd expect a learner to be guided by the instructor, but what of some poor lass ,who'd just passed her test a few hours ago ,faced with the possibility of a cycle coming straight at her, and with horrendous consequences for the rider.

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 13, 2014 21:58 
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botach wrote:
who thinks those on two wheels can do no wrong.


I don' think this and I've never said it.

Why do you keep insisting I have?


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