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PostPosted: Sat Sep 21, 2013 15:52 
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http://www.telegraph.co.uk/men/active/recreational-cycling/10323653/War-declared-on-the-Lycra-louts-on-wheels.html

As the Tour of Britain arrives in Surrey, the villagers who are fed up with cyclists are fighting back

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 21, 2013 20:34 
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nicely balanced article :whome:


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 22, 2013 12:21 
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Tour of Britain went (almost) past my front door on Monday! Closed the main road for quite a while. As it happened, I was in Essex that day, so I didn't get to see it. I wonder what they do in situations like this when an emergency services vehicle needs to get through? I guess it's less of a problem in more urban areas with lots of alternative routes, but in rural areas you can sometimes be stuck with either a vastly extended journey time on single track roads or a detour of tens of miles to use another main road of equivalent speed. Can cycling clubs really apply for road closures for their races? If so, does it cost them anything?


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 22, 2013 12:41 
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ed_m wrote:
nicely balanced article :whome:


Standard journo tactics, take the worst example of everything you can find and make it look like the norm.

http://aseasyasridingabike.wordpress.co ... -bicycles/


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 22, 2013 17:25 
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I assume that the various marathon races held on roads in the UK are able to apply for road closure like the cycle races.

However, I am not aware of this possibility being available to motor clubs who want to hold a rally on the public highway. Perhaps it is to do with the old chestnut of pedestrians and cyclists having the "right" to use the highway while motorists merely have a licence to do so. If so, then this artificial and antiquated distinction should be done away with so that every road user is treated similarly.

The article headline is grossly exaggerating the villagers point that they are fed up with cyclists using the local roads as racetracks. It's not the once a year Tour of Britain, it's the thoughtless cyclists who go out very often to beat their best time on a specific route. It sounds strangely familiar. What's the name of the website that allows cyclists to post their best times?

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 22, 2013 18:49 
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malcolmw wrote:
I assume that the various marathon races held on roads in the UK are able to apply for road closure like the cycle races.

However, I am not aware of this possibility being available to motor clubs who want to hold a rally on the public highway.


Some still do it though.

http://www.grayshott.com/wordpress/grou ... ace-track/

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It's not the once a year Tour of Britain, it's the thoughtless cyclists who go out very often to beat their best time on a specific route.


Strava. Not all of "us cyclists" (cos I know you need to simplify the world into them and us despite a lot of "the cyclists" on their 12k bikes also having one or more very nice cars) have respect for the Strava lot.

Also, whenever I go out cycling that way drivers do have to slow and pass in places, but then more often that not we catch them up again waiting in a massive queue OF CARS at the next junction. I've had words with several drivers who have buzzed me along one narrow stretch when I catch them again sitting in a massive queue OF CARS.


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 22, 2013 19:07 
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malcolmw wrote:
If so, then this artificial and antiquated distinction should be done away with so that every road user is treated similarly.



And if you can't see why allowing runners and cyclists to have races on closed public roads is slightly different to allowing motor vehicles to do the same then you need your head examining.

Notwithstanding they were talking about having an F1 race in central london, which would be well cool, but it's not like it would happen on public roads as I'd bet they'd have to have some sort of legislation to put them under the control of the event organiser, and naturally there'd be millions spent on erecting safety barriers and walls.


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 22, 2013 20:40 
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Reference to Malcom's bit about motoring events, Tone will possible know if road closures still happen in Birmingham as used to happen for one event .

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 22, 2013 22:52 
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When I cycle to and from work, in around the 20 minutes it take, I am lucky to see more than two or three others... but I know there are more, as I can see their tracks when the path is damp.
I seem to see differing riders most days in rotation... mostly they are regulars, but we each set off at slightly different times but I always say good morning or evening as we pass each other whoever they are.

Most either return my greeting... or nod if they are going uphill, but one or possibly two ignore me completely, staring steadfastly ahead.
Cycling up hill into the setting sun one evening, I was in the centre of the path, when I heard a stream of abuse - then realised it was directed at me by a rider travelling down the hill at some speed. He was not prepared to consider that I could not see him, nor abate his speed and course!

In this area at least, I think it's an age thing - those who acknowledge me are mainly over 25.
If I greet a walker, the older they are, the more enthusiastic their return greeting.
The friendliest folk are pensioners - and the horse riders I encounter, who seem to appreciate that I pull off the path and stop - and in poor light, switch off my flashing front light until they have passed by.
Those drivers, cyclists and walkers who are inconsiderate to others are in the minority - but their behaviour makes them stand out more than their more reasonable compatriots.

What is really needed in ALL AREAS OF SOCIETY, is a little more time and consideration for others!!

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 23, 2013 07:43 
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@weepej

The alleged Hindhead Tunnel "racing" is clearly not an organised event and is probably illegal. This cannot be compared to organised events on the public highway like marathons or cycle racing.

You misunderstand my point above. By arguing for equal treatment for all road users I was not advocating car racing to be allowed but rather that cycle and foot races be banned as well. The inconvenience to residents caused by these events is unacceptable.

Thank you for the Strava name. Can you imagine the outcry from BRAKE et al if a similar site existed for car drivers? This type of site is unacceptable and probably more morally flawed than pornography.

F1 racing on closed public roads is done in various locations throughout the world but generally in places which do not have the space for a dedicated off-road facility (Monaco, Singapore).

Finally, a point on the definition of "cyclists". Irrespective of any other cars etc. that anyone might own, a cyclist is someone who, at the time I encounter them, is on a bicycle. This is pretty clear to me.

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 23, 2013 14:19 
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Sure the answer to all of this is simply to create proper bike racing circuits?

I use the Garmin specified software to record my routes and runs on my own computer for my private use - both the MTB and racing bike.

I really sympathise with the appalling behaviour shown toward others (as in all road users not just residents), by certain people. But they are all people and I think it is not just a certain group but from many cyclists. I saw one in front of me the other day and he swore at a car totally un-necessary. He had failed to allow for the pinch point in the road off a roundabout and a car who had little option (although could have been s little further out - but then would have been close to the car beside them) but the 'cut the overly (very un-necessary) sharp corner' off the roundabout. The cyclist ought to have allowed for it, and he didn't.
The other day I didn't cycle down the inside a car as all my observations told me they were going to turn left, and with no indication s/he then turned left. Had I not been observant I would have been hit, but who's fault - well to me I would have been partly to blame. However I think this is where things are going seriously wrong.
Some if not many cyclists, seem less capable of showing tolerance, good observation, anticipation awareness, courtesy etc.,
You only need a driver also to show equal ineptitude, and you have an accident waiting to happen.

I have seen cyclists on road races all over the Country, from major A roads to small winding country routes as described in the article. However the organised routes are littered with signs and 'points' with supporting course personnel. These help to inform road users.
However when cyclists ride 2-4 abreast 'for fun', then I think the Police ought to be called as it is a moving chicane that needs to be dealt with.
It is an offense to race on the road in a car, so surely a bike also isn't allowed, unless it is a proper organised event, I can't find a rule that says they can.

The issue comes not from a cyclist simply going quickly along the road, who could just legitimately be travelling quickly but when a group start to travel quickly and insist on being in a 'prime position' on the public road and refusing to go into a single file, this then becomes a whole different ball game. They show discourtesy, create a road block and a hazard and are putting themselves and others at risk. Two abreast on many roads is potentially dangerous and usually only safe when there is considerate traffic allowing for the unexpected or when there is next to no traffic or on straight deserted roads.

I an concerned that reasons of 'someone may be killed' given as a 'reason for apparent care' is becoming the latest 'fad phrase'. We need many good road safety procedures and systems in place to prevent accidents altogether, not just a 'fear of death'. We all must be responsible and whilst we all might take managed risks which will depend on our experience, knowledge, ability and skills to be safe and appropriate. Any reductions to these skills become crucial in how well, we react to other road users.
Having great police presence on these roads would soon remind those who hog their road space to the detriment of other travellers, would help to resolve this problem.
The local residents who will be effected, MUST be consulted by their local Councils for these events. Allowances may need to be made to help local residents travel when they must.
http://www.strava.com/stand-with-us wrote:
1 "We Know The Rules
Laws and rules are created for our protection. Cycling, running and swimming are inherently dangerous and following the law, and common sense, when it comes to traffic, weather, or conditions, reduces our odds of getting hurt or hurting others. It's as simple as that. "
4 "We Think Ahead
We showcase a lot of awesome data about where we go, who we work out with and how we push ourselves. If we don't want everyone to know what we're up to, we take the necessary privacy precautions before we upload, like setting privacy zones and choosing who can follow us and what they can see."
I guess they recognise the potential enthusiasts going overboard and this is what we are seeing and experiencing, although not necessarily related to Strava.
Cyclists are forgetting the roads are not race tracks (unless during an event), they are public highways.

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 23, 2013 21:06 
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malcolmw wrote:

Finally, a point on the definition of "cyclists". Irrespective of any other cars etc. that anyone might own, a cyclist is someone who, at the time I encounter them, is on a bicycle. This is pretty clear to me.


To me there two types of cyclist ,from observation . Those who may /may not be dressed in safety gear ,but obey the laws of the road and when in parks, show respect and understanding for pedestrians and pets. Then there's those who treat pavements ( occupied or not) as a secondary road. Total lack of understanding of traffic laws and total lack of respect for the safety of others. It's not the first time I've bawled out one of these louts bowling along at speed in a non cycling part of local park whilst texting ,with toddlers and pets on the path . :loco: One half of this park has a red circle with a bicycle in it. ( Any cyclist care to tell me what it means ?) , whilst the other has blue signs showing one half for pedestrians and the other for cycles.

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 28, 2013 09:39 
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SafeSpeedv2 wrote:
Cyclists are forgetting the roads are not race tracks (unless during an event), they are public highways.


Can we stop generalising please.

When you say "Cyclists are forgetting the roads are not race tracks" your words communicate that you believe ALL cyclists think this.


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 28, 2013 20:34 
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From your words and attitude ,I see nothing to correct that opinion .

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 28, 2013 21:00 
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botach wrote:
From your words and attitude ,I see nothing to correct that opinion .



Yeah, look at these b****ds!!!

Image


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 28, 2013 22:17 
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is that you in middle . OR perhaps the sensible one sans helmet .

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Drivers are like donkeys -they respond best to a carrot, not a stick .Road safety experts are like Asses - best kept covered up ,or sat on


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 27, 2014 02:03 
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Yep OK I agree I should have started with 'Some cyclists .... etc"
Reminder to everyone : Please hit the 'quote' button, than the Reply button when wishing to reply quoting others, :) as it helps to follow who says what. :)

In my defence I have not been well for some months and although getting better it is slow going.

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