Safe Speed Forums

Hi all,

even in this day and age we still have people with kids freely moving about in the back seat. I witnessed it yesterday and something i've noticed most times I see this is very interesting, that is, most of the time I see this happening the there is never a female in the car. i'm not pointing the finger at anyone here it's just an observation although it is a pressing concern that is still happening.


Regards


Andrew

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It's a scam........or possibly a scamola


Homer Simpson

Rear seat belts became mandatory in 1986 (D plate) you don't need to strap them in by law before that. I think it is 1966 for front belts.

I do see a lot of kids jumping about in back seats not strapped in. Not sure I agree with the female bias though. I am more shocked at the number of kids I see sitting on they parents knees IN THE FRONT of the car.

The worse on of all was a kid standing on the centre arm rest with his head out the sun roof...decapitation anyone!

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Speed camera policy Kills

On a similar line, overloaded cars which by definition have more occupants than seatbelts and possibly more weight than the designers had in mind. There was a crash recently in Oxfordshire in which three boys died. The reports said that they were travelling in a Citroen Xsara with four friends and someone's mum was driving. It was certainly reported as being a five seater, so it clearly wasn't the MPV version. So that's eight in a car with seats and belts for five . For some reason the Citroen crossed the carriageway and hit another car, whose driver also died. I don't know if the three boys who lost their lives were the ones without belts or if they were killed as a result of an unbelted fellow pasenger hitting them during the crash, or even if the seatbelts had nothing to do with who died and who survived. Whatever, there's no way I'd take the gamble that the driver took with who gets a seat belt and who doesn't.

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Make everything as simple as possible, but not simpler - Einstein

Kids in the back seat cause accidents. Accidents in the back seat causes kids.

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Anyone who tells you that nothing is impossible has never bathed in a saucer of water.

Pet hate of mine Andy, and I will ALWAYS stop these motorists. More often than not they'll get a ticket, because in these circumstances it is the most effective method of ensuring it doesn't happen again. I don't agree about the gender issue, but the kid gets the blame almost every time!

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Fixed ideas are like cramp, for instance in the foot, yet the best remedy is to step on them.

Ian

It's the Kids fault!!! I don't think so, it is because the parents let them get away with it.

Fine them, and tell them that if it is "the kids fault", then they shoiuld fine the kids by taking the money out of their pocket money.

I have always considered that children in a car can be far more distracting than mobile phones, eating, smoking, drinking (non-alc) or almost anything else that a driver could be doing... How about "1/3 of all accidents are due to children in the car"; I bet it is closer to the truth than speeding.

Perhaps that nice advert where the son in the back brained mum because he wasn't belted in should be repeated, or even drummed in as part of road safety lessons at school.

Completely with Ian on this one - it is one of the things I will ALWAYS stop for and ALWAYS issue a ticket - personally I don't think it should be a ticket offence, it should be a straight to court and mandatory ban.

I'd also like to see the drivers concerned made to see some of the consequences of such moronic actions. Trust me, you never forget the sight of being first on scene when an unrestrained child has hit the windscreen in a 60mph+ RTC.

But seatbelts isn't the only part of this - smaller children wearing an adult seatbelt but with no booster cushion / child harness is only marginally safer than nothing at all.

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Never point a speedmeter at a civil or military aircraft, vessel or armoured vehicle. Many military aircraft, vehicles or vessels have target acquisition detectors, some of which initiate automatic counter measures.
Association of Chief Police Officers

I'll have to watch out on this one, as despite the best efforts of my wife and myself, our youngest son occasionally undoes his seatbelt, in order to reach down to retrieve something, or adjust his clothing. He has a learning difficulty which makes him unaware of danger, and we do constantly check he is strapped in when together, or stopped at traffic lights etc. but this is not always possible when on the motorway with only one of us with him.
If asked, he will usually tell you he IS fastened in, even if he is not, to avoid getting told off for it, so under some circumstances, I dont see what else we can do - he is eight years old, so childproof fittings are not an option.
He does however know the UK speed limits, when NSL applies, or 70 for dual carriageways etc., and is slowly picking up on hazard awarness. I have started him early because his condition will make it difficult for him to learn to drive, and an early start seemed the best approach.

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Time to take responsibility for our actions.. and don't be afraid of speaking out!

You'll be pleased to know that cameras don't enforce this legislation Ernest. You'll have to rely on your reasonable explanation to us and our acceptance of that.
I presume he's cute enough to keep the seat belt looking like it's fastened, which would in turn make it inordinately difficult for us to notice that it's not fastened.
I think you'll find that the vast majority of Bib would accept your explanation.

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Fixed ideas are like cramp, for instance in the foot, yet the best remedy is to step on them.

Ian

Bit of the pot calling the kettle black as I spent most of my childhood in the back with no seatbelt although it was before there was any real awareness of it in the back and just as the front belt awareness was sprouting. I do remember that when you were in the front you wore the belt but the back didn't matter somehow.


Regards


Andrew

_________________
It's a scam........or possibly a scamola


Homer Simpson

All our chaps target such drivers - acid lectures and a £30 quid fine as well. Draconian on this. Cars do stop faster than they used to - and the knock effect is that they pull up a lot more sharply - which sadly increased the likelyhood of any thing not fastened down in the rear behaving like a missile.

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Take with a chuckle or a grain of salt
Drive without COAST and it's all your own fault!

A SMILE is a curve that sets everything straight (P Diller).

A Smiley Per post
FINES USfor our COAST!

Approach love and cooking with reckless abandon - but driving with a smile and a COAST calm mind.

I was very guilty of this - as tots got them a car seat - don't know why but perhaps old fashioned logic.
Then one day pal of mine showed me picture of child that went through windscreen - best example i have is a pound of mince.
Since then , if i hadnot got boosters the had belt on with loop under arm ( to save neck injury0.
Best example i can give - few years ago i got tailended on m6.
Car ( Sierra) was a right off - only 1 year old - kids in back all over 12 had belts on -worst case was the lad with lap belt.sore tum for a few days.

THE maths - child weighs 20 kg ( about 3 stone = 45 pound)
Car is travelling at 30 mph(44 ft/sec)


ke of child = 45*44 = 1980 ft lb
one ton = 2240 pound. Anything less than 10 inch and kid hits parent with force of one ton.( LIKE being hit by car)

So bi bi parent, certainly bi bi windscreen and kid too -

To see what kid lookes like go to butchers shop and look at mince. - not pretty.

I nag, i preach - strap them in.
Its now gotten that bad that my grandkids nag me when i'm a bit slow getting my belt on.

I had the problem with my daughter when she was young, she was always undoing her seatbelt.

Solution: I heard the belt click, looked and saw she had undone it YET again, so I slowed down, the road was clear behind me, I indicated left and hit the brakes fairly hard, she slid off her child seat and headbutted the front passenger seat.
The impact was not hard, but it showed her what could happen, and she never did it again.
Yes, I agree there was a potential for danger and damage, but I had brought the speed down to about 5mph and considered it safe to carry out.
I have had to deal with the aftermath of RTAs, and never wanted my daughter to look like some of them I had seen.

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Semper in excreta, nur quantitat variat.

Just seen the picture of the airbag damage on another post - wonder just how effective one of a kid after it had gone throught windscreen might be in reversing the trend to carry kids in the rear of cars with no belt.
Probably raise a riot -