Safe Speed Forums

http://thatsmotoring.blogspot.com/2008/12/isa-boon-or-curse.html

What a fantastic idea! Or so the IAM say, and they are in favour of it. But, I think it is a potential disaster waiting to happen. It will be capable of not only stopping you going above a certain speed, it could even 'helpfully' apply the brakes for you! Can anyone spot a potential and rather deadly flaw with this 'intelligent' system?

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www.thatsnews.org.uk / www.thatsnews.blogspot.com / http://thatsmotoring.blogspot.com/

I don't think it would work for everyone, especially those who "like cars", so to speak. They like the sensation of driving, rather
than getting from A to B, and devices which interfere with that would be unwelcome.

It would be OK for me, as I am a slow and careful driver and I always have very humble, unegotistical cars. This would just be an extra safeguard,
as I rarely break the limit anyway. It would be very useful in malls and car parks, where you could limit people to (say) walking pace. You'd be
surprised how costly bumps can be above that speed.

I can see one plus point with this system. When you get the odd moron who likes to speed up just as you are about to pass him and draw level, he will put his foot down and fade at the limit, me in my old car with no "idiot control" will be able to accelerate safely past.....

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My views do not represent Safespeed but those of a driver who has driven for 39 yrs, in all conditions, at all times of the day & night on every type of road and covered well over a million miles, so knows a bit about what makes for safety on the road,what is really dangerous and needs to be observed when driving and quite frankly, the speedo is way down on my list of things to observe to negotiate Britain's roads safely, but I don't expect some fool who sits behind a desk all day to appreciate that.

I used the cruise control in canada whee some of the roads were 75 miles between buildings. I had to turn it off because I was falling asleep. I fear there will be more accidents of a very serious nature where the driver is awake but not tuned in.

I hate traveling through specs sections where every car travels at the same speed, I find it soperific. I hate working on a production line. After a while I ger the urge to mix it up a little!

This is not ment as an insult but less able drivers might find it an aid but higher level drivers might find it a disaster. As I get older I might want all this help! but not now!

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Speed limit sign radio interview. TV Snap Unhappy
“It has never been the rule in this country – I hope it never will be - that suspected criminal offences must automatically be the subject of prosecution” He added that there should be a prosecution: “wherever it appears that the offence or the circumstances of its commission is or are of such a character that a prosecution in respect thereof is required in the public interest”
This approach has been endorsed by Attorney General ever since 1951. CPS Code

there was a lovely quote i caught (on the beeb i think?) not sure who by but the (almost) exact phrase was:

"it stops the drivers having to worry about their speed"

which is somehow a good thing ?

i'm not going to guess... please state.

Well, I don't know either, but would guess it has something to do with HM Governments less than rosy history in large IT projects. What happens when there is the inevitable softwear crash? Either everything stops: Bad. Or loads of drivers that have forgotten how the think suddenly have to think: bad

They could get micorosoft to write the software.

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Andrew.

Odd you should say that, the first thing I thought when I saw the thread title was-

Why is he asking about Internet Security & Acceleration server in 'Improving road safety'?

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Driving fast is for a particular time and place, I can do it I just only do it occasionally because I am a gentleman.
- James May

And my first thought was: Individual Savings Account or how best to save for that new car.

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When I see an adult on a bicycle, I do not despair for the future of the human race. H.G. Wells
When I see a youth in a motor car I do d.c.brown

EDITOR: So, if you need to accelerate away from danger (for example, a load has just slipped from a trailer directly in front of your car) and you need to take rapid evasive action, not only will the ISA not allow you to accelerate out of danger, it will very kindly apply your brakes, thus ensuring a crash. And exactly how is that 'Intelligent'? I am not certain that the people who put forward this proposal or the IAM have thought this idea through.

That would be the most obvious danger. The more insidious dangers are those of
a) allowing Big Brother to further infiltrate our lives
b) further engendering a culture of incompetence by increasingly relying on devices to think and act for us
...

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The Rules for ALL ROAD USERS:
1) No one gets hurt
2) Nothing gets hit, except to protect others; see Rule#1
3) The Laws of Physics are invincible and immutable - so-called 'laws' of men are not
4) You are always immediately and ultimately responsible for your safety first, then proximately responsible for everyone's
Do not let other road users' mistakes become yours, nor yours become others
5) The rest, including laws of the land, is thoughtful observation, prescience, etiquette, decorum, and cooperation

I'm really shocked by the IAM condoning this idea. Anything that takes away the need for a driver to think for themselves or show any sort of skill level is exactly the opposite of any sort of "advanced" driving.

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My views do not represent Safespeed but those of a driver who has driven for 39 yrs, in all conditions, at all times of the day & night on every type of road and covered well over a million miles, so knows a bit about what makes for safety on the road,what is really dangerous and needs to be observed when driving and quite frankly, the speedo is way down on my list of things to observe to negotiate Britain's roads safely, but I don't expect some fool who sits behind a desk all day to appreciate that.

Yes, I was very disappointed too. I used to look up to that institution but they seem to be increasingly "dumbing down" and toeing the government's line. I can only hope they'e been misquoted. My biggest fear is that an overnight mandatory introduction of such devices to the National fleet (were it possible!) WOULD deliver a reduction in road casualties. I don't believe for a moment that this would be for the reasons all the rabbid anti-motorist organisations like Brake would have us believe though. I think that anything that suddenly becomes "different" causes motorists to think a bit harder. In particular, I'm thinking of the odd studies where removal of road signs, traffic lights, road markings etc seem to make a stretch of road safer. My gut feeling is that if someone suddenly did it to my car, I'd be put even more on my guard than usual until I got used to the car's new behaviour. I have visions of triumphant politicians patting themselves on the back at having achieved record reductions in road casualties and the creams of "I told you so" from the anti-motoring organisations.

But a year or two AFTER the screams have died down, I have a funny feeling that the casualty rates will be right back where they were...

I'm mystified as to how this is supposed to give a 29% reduction in KSI when we are told that exceeding the speed limit is only a contributory factor in 4-5% of cases?

Whynot

Spin,spin, glorious spin

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My views do not represent Safespeed but those of a driver who has driven for 39 yrs, in all conditions, at all times of the day & night on every type of road and covered well over a million miles, so knows a bit about what makes for safety on the road,what is really dangerous and needs to be observed when driving and quite frankly, the speedo is way down on my list of things to observe to negotiate Britain's roads safely, but I don't expect some fool who sits behind a desk all day to appreciate that.

I am very open-minded to this and before we all jump on our high horses, lets have a pilot scheme and trial this technology rather than ranting on like a bunch of neo-ludites.

All we need to do is select a group of people, who represent a cross section of normal reasonable members of society, to have these thingys fitted and see how they get on.

I propose that every MP has one fitted for a 5 year trial.

Well, they have been trialled for a few years, in various forms.
They cannot be trialled in the needed form because the gps system [as is] is not good enough for full use.
The [new] [improved] galileo system is needed. Another 3-4 billion euros [and probably, in reality, 6-8 billion] to be re-paid by extra driving costs.
It will probably be the "pass the tag" system at first. Where the charges are deducted directly from bank accounts. It will probably be based on the similar German "toll collect" system:

http://www.computing.co.uk/itweek/comment/2140371/german-road-pricing-loses-way
As you can see, the idea of always being right will appeal to practically every council [or local government parasites such as TfL]

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The world runs on oil, period. No other substance can compete when it comes to energy density, flexibility, ease of handling, ease of transportation. If oil didn’t exist we would have to invent it.”

56 years after it was decided it was needed, the Bedford Bypass is nearing completion. The last single carriageway length of it.We have the most photogenic mayor though, always being photographed doing nothing

Yep, I can see situations where you leave a 30MPH limit and are struggling for half a mile or so before the "system" lets you get above 30MPH.

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My views do not represent Safespeed but those of a driver who has driven for 39 yrs, in all conditions, at all times of the day & night on every type of road and covered well over a million miles, so knows a bit about what makes for safety on the road,what is really dangerous and needs to be observed when driving and quite frankly, the speedo is way down on my list of things to observe to negotiate Britain's roads safely, but I don't expect some fool who sits behind a desk all day to appreciate that.

I was thinking more of the roads [many] running alongside dual carriageways and motorways, where separation is only a few metres. In which case the speed [limit] will constantly be changing from 70 to [lower] as the separation increases/decreases.
I suppose some sort if time lag will ensure that that won't happen.
And problems will occur passing under/over different limits.

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The world runs on oil, period. No other substance can compete when it comes to energy density, flexibility, ease of handling, ease of transportation. If oil didn’t exist we would have to invent it.”

56 years after it was decided it was needed, the Bedford Bypass is nearing completion. The last single carriageway length of it.We have the most photogenic mayor though, always being photographed doing nothing

On an initial read through the [complete] report, it seems as if there has been some window dressing going-on.

http://www.cfit.gov.uk/docs/2008/isa/pdf/isa-report.pdf

The pollution figures make interesting readings, since CO2 is not a pollutant.
The actual pollutants, unburnt hydrocarbons were not lowered by ISA, and were increased at the lower speed limits.
I also wonder what happens if a gps lock is unavailable.

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The world runs on oil, period. No other substance can compete when it comes to energy density, flexibility, ease of handling, ease of transportation. If oil didn’t exist we would have to invent it.”

56 years after it was decided it was needed, the Bedford Bypass is nearing completion. The last single carriageway length of it.We have the most photogenic mayor though, always being photographed doing nothing