Safe Speed Forums

Dougman: Thanks for that !!

Civil Engineer: "Another issue though with revised CDM...will the regs actually impact on the end user, surely they are what they say 'Construction, Design and Maintenance Regs.

If the road is not fit for purpose due to a design issue then surely the designer could be pursued through the courts for negligence?"

Know what you are saying but there are two main views on this:

1. The HSC is gold plating legislation again to little practical use especially if the HSE don't prosecute

and

2. There is already an element of fit for purpose in terms of maintenance considerations so why not ensure that it meets the other 'fit for purpose' criteria i.e. it meets current building regs, DDA requirements and design 'best practice' .

I've been involved in a lot of projects where the designers have ignored DDA as it keeps thier costs down yet the client then has to spend a shed load of money re-fitting or adjusting to DDA standards, Designers sticking to old Building Regs knowing that a change is around the corner and that in the users lifetime of the project the building, road, structure will require re-fit to bring up to a standard that could have been incorporated much more easily and efficiently during the original design stage.

If nothing else, it would make it easier to pursue designers through courts as currently the main defence is that we comply with current standards (ignoring the higher standard round the corner) and 'it wasn't in our design brief' So many client's do not have a fit for purpose clause in contracts either due to ignorance or a desire for the cheapest option, especially when some other mug will get the bill for re-fits/upgrades.

Very few cases for negligence against designers get to court because of this let alone result in an award being made. The proposed changes will help redress that balance.

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Gordon Brown saying I got the country into it's current economic mess so I'll get us out of it is the same as Bomber Harris nipping over to Dresden and offering to repair a few windows.

Chaos, panic and disorder - my work here is done.

http://www.wildcrafts.co.uk

I'd be suprised, but will be happy to be proved wrong, if a Client or Designer (CDM) will ever be pursued under CDM if a road user has an accident once the road is open and complete given that CDM is primarily aimed at safety of operatives during construction, maintenance and demolition.

As for how to recognise SMA ...... Hmm .... you'll have to look at the road surface and you'll see that all the coarse aggregate (chippings) are similar sized and touching each other - not unlike a rice crispy cake!!

more traditional surfacings like say Hot Rolled ashpalt have the chips rolled into a bed of asphalt (sand). imagine levelling off sand then shaking stones on it through a sieve then rolling them in.

there are other types between the two but thats basically it.

Dougman will have somethig to say though I'm sure.

Civil Engineer like you would be surprised, the HSE are not prosecuting Client's for late appointment and notification one of the most basic duties that's why I feel that option 1. is most likely.

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Gordon Brown saying I got the country into it's current economic mess so I'll get us out of it is the same as Bomber Harris nipping over to Dresden and offering to repair a few windows.

Chaos, panic and disorder - my work here is done.

http://www.wildcrafts.co.uk

The average driver would have no idea they were on SMA.
To the untrained eye the desription would basically be 'tarmac'.
I doubt many police traffic officers would be able to tell it from other surfaces.
Having for 2 years managed highway works (on-site) for a local authority, and the Highways Agency, I have yet to lay anything other than SMA.
fatbotim.

i have noticed this about new road surfacing but didnt realise it was as big an issue thanks for pointing it out
i have been taking care if i see new road paint i do consider the fact it will probably be slippery it isnt just stopping thats a problem wheelspin is so easily induced when pulling away as well.

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Im difficult to spot in this 44foot truck sorry i must have it in cloak mode again