Safe Speed Forums

http://www.thisislondon.com/news/london ... 20Standard

Speed trap fines are scrapped in blunder
By Andrew Gilligan, Evening Standard
23 June 2005

Thousands of motorists caught in London's most controversial speed camera trap are to have fines refunded after Transport for London admitted one of the devices was in the wrong place.

The refunds - totalling £330,000 - are a serious blow to the credibility of one of London's highest profile speed trap sites.

The 20mph speed limit in Upper Thames Street rakes in about ?4,000 a day because drivers do not associate a busy dual carriageway with such a low limit. It has caused fury among the road's 60,000 daily users.

But the Standard has learned that one of the new digital Specs cameras on the street was wrongly installed outside the 20mph zone.

The fault applies only to the westbound direction, but more than 160 drivers a week have been wrongly fined £60 and given points on their licences. The London Safety Camera Partnership (LSCP), which operates the scheme, admitted in a statement today: "A sign marking the start of a 20mph speed limit zone on Upper Thames Street is incorrectly positioned.

"As a consequence motorists were being monitored for a 20mph limit whilst still in the 30mph zone for a short distance. We will refund all the fines paid and cancel all the licence endorsements. Whilst the signs are repositioned, mobile cameras will operate."

Nearly 5,600 motorists are affected by the error, it is understood. The fines refund will total at least £335,800.

The LSCP decided on the refunds at its project board meeting earlier this week, the Standard has learned. The partnership is now braced for legal action from furious drivers who may wrongly have lost their licences.

"It is a biggie," said one source. "It is a very sensitive decision."

The new cameras were installed almost eight months ago to cover a stretch of building works between London and Southwark bridges.

Unlike standard Gatso cameras, they measure speed between a pair of devices. A single camera out of place throws the entire scheme into chaos, with the result that everyone passing through must be refunded.

This year it emerged the Upper Thames Street scheme had collected £84,000 in fines in only three weeks.

=========================

Safe Speed issued the following PR at 17:15 today:

PR207: London folly - speed camera operations descend into chaos

News: for immediate release

The London Evening Standard today reports that £330,000 in speed camera fines
must be refunded. Apparently one of the cameras was installed in the wrong
place.

Paul Smith, founder of the Safe Speed road safety campaign
(www.safespeed.org.uk) said: "This is sheer incompetence. The inconvenience
and the waste of public money is astronomical. With errors being exposed in
speed camera prosecutions all over the country, every motorist who receives
the dreaded notice must question every detail BEFORE he submits the £60 pound
fine."

"Some of those wrongly convicted in London will have lost their jobs because
of a so-called offence they did not commit. They must be compensated
properly with public funds. It will be expensive and heads must roll at
Transport for London."

"After £700 million pounds in speed camera fines Britain's road have not got
safer. We won't get back on the right road safety track until speed cameras
are consigned to the history books. It is now crystal clear that they do not
improve road safety so it's only a matter of time. How much longer do we have
to wait before the authorities confess that it was all a massive blunder?"

<ends>

_________________
Paul Smith
Our scrap speed cameras petition got over 28,000 sigs
The Safe Speed campaign demands a return to intelligent road safety

Always does it to me when they shut their knackers in the drawer like this. Health and Safety need to warn 'em about that cash register.

_________________
Make everything as simple as possible, but not simpler - Einstein

You just can't buy publicity like that.

You'll doubtless notice that the 20mph limit signs are going to be moved, not the camera. That speaks volumes to me about where the priorities lie.

I am pretty sure credit for this blunder (if that term even begins to describe the magnitude of the situation) should go to David from PePiPoo. Here is the thread describing how it went:

http://pepipoo.com/NewForums2/viewtopic.php?t=6016

Gareth

This is a concern. One of the M6 SPECS cameras (J16) where the new roadworks have just started is in the NSL zone, just after where the 40 limit ends on the Northbound carriageway.

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Speed camera policy Kills

It's a wonder they did'nt claim that the report was "Sexed up" by the Evening Standard!!

£84,000 in three weeks? They must be working then, just think what the revenue could have been if motorists ignored the cameras, and failed to slow down!

_________________
Time to take responsibility for our actions.. and don't be afraid of speaking out!

So is there a school, a hospital or an old people's home on this dual carriageway? Or can they now justify a 20mph limit on a road just because it's "a little bit busy" or "sometimes people cross the road there".

Or do they say, "well we had a pedestrian accident there last week. The car was doing 25mph. So we'll reduce the limit to 20 and hey presto no more accidents! God, we're clever."

Of course, to those of us with more than one brain cell, the "£84k in 3 days" tells the real story.

I'm glad they've got bitten on this one. Not that it will stop them, they will just extend the 20MPH limit as far as is necessary to ensure continued revenue. When people (grudgingly) begin to adhere to this unreasonable limt, and revenue starts to tail off, they'll just put another 20MPH limit somewhere else, move the fixed camera there and put a Talivan on Upper Thames Street three or four times a week.

Evil is nothing if not predictable.

They seem to be aware of this though - there is a black-on-yellow sign on the post saying "camera not in use".

Chris

I have driven on that road recently and a sign flashes up showing your speed as you pass it, even though it is before the 20mph sign. I got 30mph flashed at me once which was the speed limit at that particular point.