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PostPosted: Sun Jun 26, 2011 22:20 
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The Independent - here
The Independent - Matt Chorley wrote:
Is the speed camera near you a cash cow or a lifesaver?
Minister admits that plans to release data on every speed trap could lead to vandalism
By Matt Chorley, Political Correspondent -Sunday, 26 June 2011

Details of accidents prevented and fines raised by every camera will be published

Details of the accidents prevented – and the fines raised – by every speed camera in England are to be made public for the first time, allowing drivers to distinguish the cash generators from the life savers.

Ministers fear the move could lead to a wave of vandalism targeting the motorist's nemesis, but hope it will also demonstrate where precisely cameras have reduced the rate of crashes and injuries.

From next month, drivers will be able to access Transport Department figures online back to 1990 and see exactly what impact speed cameras have had on every road in England. They will include annual collision and casualty data showing the numbers of people killed and seriously injured.

The roads minister, Mike Penning, said: "This will expose where cameras are and are not doing their job. It is all about empowerment. We can only do what we do with road safety if people believe it isn't just about raising money but is about saving lives."

He admitted that, before 2004, many local authorities installed speed cameras regardless of how many accidents took place in order to control traffic. In many cases it meant raising money from drivers on roads where safety was not being compromised.

"What this will show is where there weren't any accidents before, and accidents afterwards are minimal, or may even have gone up because people have reacted differently. But it will also expose where accidents have dropped."

Police and local authorities resisted the release of the data, he admitted. "The police are concerned that certain cameras may be vandalised more than they are now, but that's not a reason not to do it."

Councils in England have been told to release casualty and accident numbers for every camera site, before and after its installation. Police forces will also publish information on the amount each site raises in fines and other punishments meted out to speeding drivers.

The publication of the data, due to be announced tomorrow, is the latest example of the coalition's attempt to increase government transparency. Other moves include forcing public bodies to release details of spending, salaries of top officials and travel costs.

Data released last year by Thames Valley Safer Roads Partnership showed several cameras caught more than 100 drivers a day.
Excellent delighted to hear it.
The accidents though that have not occurred does not mean that cameras have worked - we must see traffic volumes too. We must take into consideration the full impact that the whole economic situation has caused too.

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2011 01:33 
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Daily Mail Online here
Daily Mail - Kirsty Walker wrote:
'Cash cow' speed cameras will be named for the first time in transparency drive
By Kirsty Walker - Last updated at 4:16 PM on 26th June 2011

Britain's most lucrative speed cameras will be named for the first time, under a new transparency drive launched by ministers today.
Motorists will be given access to previously hidden statistics showing the number of speeding prosecutions and accidents at camera sites.

The information will enable drivers to build up a 'league table' of Britain's busiest speed cameras as well as judging their effectiveness in saving lives.
Gatso speed camera on the M11 southbound between junctions 5 and 4 in Essex where there has been an increase in accidents

Up until now, authorities have been reluctant to publish admit which cameras were the biggest money spinners, with details having to be prised out of them using Freedom of Information laws.
There has been mounting criticism that the cameras - also known as gatsos - are being used to raise revenue rather than save lives.

One camera at the southern end of the M11 in Essex, which raises over £1million-a-year in fines, has been found to have increased the numbers of crashes and injuries at its site.
Accidents have doubled since the machine was installed on the M11 at its junction with the North Circular A406 near Woodford, Essex.
Police said crashes happened because motorists slowed down ahead of the camera and then speeded up once they were clear of it.

Another traffic camera at a yellow box junction on Battersea Bridge Road in South London has been dubbed 'money box' after fining 2,000 drivers a month - raising over £1million a year.
Critics have pointed out that bad congestion caused by engineering works meant that many unsuspecting drivers found themselves trapped in the box.
Anyone who stopped in the box for longer than five seconds was issued with a fine of £60 - which could double if not paid immediately.

Now, however, local authorities will have to publish the numbers of accidents and casualties at camera sites - both before and after they were installed - within weeks.
Mike Penning MP said the government don't want information about speed cameras to be hidden any more
Mike Penning, the Road Safety Minister, will order police and local authorities to stop treating drivers like 'cash cows'.
Mr Penning said: 'We want to stop motorists being used as cash cows. For too long information about speed cameras has been hidden in the shadows.
'This new data will end that by clearly showing whether a camera is saving lives or just making money.'
The information on collisions and casualties which local authorities will have to provide will date back to 1990.
The number of cameras on Britain's road started to mushroom in the early 1990s. By 2010, they were understood to have generated more than £100million in fines.

Research has suggested that speed cameras have triggered at least 28,000 crashes since 2001.

The devices are found to have caused motorists to drive erratically, to not concentrate on the road and to brake suddenly when one comes into sight.

More than 80 per cent of drivers say they look at their speedometers rather than the cars in front when they approach a speed camera.
The new information will add to already-growing pressure for many cameras to be scrapped.
Although minister fear the move could lead to a wave of vandalism targeting the motorist's nemesis.

Mr Penning said: 'This will expose where cameras are and are not doing their job. It is all about empowerment. We can only do what we do with road safety if people believe it isn't just about raising money but is about saving lives.
'What this will show is where there weren't any accidents before, and accidents afterwards are minimal, or may even have gone up because people have reacted differently. But it will also expose where accidents have dropped.
'The police are concerned that certain cameras may be vandalised more than they are now, but that's not a reason not to do it.'

Peter Roberts, of the Drivers' Alliance, said: 'Speed cameras don't improve the safety of our roads. They're often placed to generate the maximum revenue.
'Speed is to blame for only 4.7 per cent of accidents.'
If people recognise that genuine interest is being shown to properly identify if cameras are good or bad and the evidence has been around for many years that they are not about road safety then why would people want to risk a Court prosecution when a speed camera is likely to be scrapped very soon !
I think heads should roll for the needless deaths and injuries that have arisen from the dogged pursuit of the use of speed cameras. I am pleased that the stats will be shown, but we must know the volume of traffic also ... prior to the scams and afterwards ...

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2011 18:45 
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Quote:
Motorists will be given access to previously hidden statistics showing the number of speeding prosecutions and accidents at camera sites.

The information will enable drivers to build up a 'league table' of Britain's busiest speed cameras as well as judging their effectiveness in saving lives.

What are the odds that camera $upporter$ will be trying to capitalise on the illusion of RTTM?

Quote:
Now, however, local authorities will have to publish the numbers of accidents and casualties at camera sites - both before and after they were installed - within weeks.

3 years before and 3 years after, by any chance? :roll:

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PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2011 22:35 
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Absolutely! The cynic in me is pretty certain that the decision to release the data would only be taken after they had found a way of making the data fit their purposes! :wink:


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 28, 2011 08:52 
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i would like to see the ratio of vehicle flow to capture rate

Quote:
The information will enable drivers to build up a 'league table' of Britain's busiest speed cameras as well as judging their effectiveness in saving lives.
Gatso speed camera on the M11 southbound between junctions 5 and 4 in Essex where there has been an increase in accidents


http://www.pocketgpsworld.com/M11-Speed-Camera-Increases-Accidents-and-Raises-500kYear-9633.php

Quote:
Some people call them Safety Cameras, others call them Speed Cameras. Today's news is one of the reasons for the latter!

Under the Freedom of Information Act (and with intervention from the Information Commissioner) Essex Police have shown that a camera on the M11 (Gatso 4785 in our database) brings in around £500,000 per year and that crashes have almost doubled! This is clearly one example where 'safety' is not paramount. The camera is placed on the southbound carriageway between junctions 4 and 5 where the speed drops from 70mph down to 50mph - obviously causing people to break suddenly.


so thats 8333 per annum or 22.8 per day, remove the emergency services and foriegn vehicles from that t a nice 20 per day on a motorway with a daily flow of 10,000 +, makes different reading IMO

Steve wrote:
Quote:
Motorists will be given access to previously hidden statistics showing the number of speeding prosecutions and accidents at camera sites.

The information will enable drivers to build up a 'league table' of Britain's busiest speed cameras as well as judging their effectiveness in saving lives.

What are the odds that camera $upporter$ will be trying to capitalise on the illusion of RTTM?


i dont believe accident data is required for roadworks steve

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PostPosted: Tue Jun 28, 2011 13:20 
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camera operator wrote:
Steve wrote:
Quote:
Motorists will be given access to previously hidden statistics showing the number of speeding prosecutions and accidents at camera sites.

The information will enable drivers to build up a 'league table' of Britain's busiest speed cameras as well as judging their effectiveness in saving lives.

What are the odds that camera $upporter$ will be trying to capitalise on the illusion of RTTM?


i dont believe accident data is required for roadworks steve

Your response is a bit redundant.

Data is going to be released, this data is what we're talking about. That data can be misused to capitalise on the RTTM illusion of benefit, misused in exactly the same way that the SCPs have done for a decade.
"At camera sites"; I didn't mention roadworks.

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2011 10:00 
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Steve wrote:
camera operator wrote:
Steve wrote:
Quote:
Motorists will be given access to previously hidden statistics showing the number of speeding prosecutions and accidents at camera sites.

The information will enable drivers to build up a 'league table' of Britain's busiest speed cameras as well as judging their effectiveness in saving lives.

What are the odds that camera $upporter$ will be trying to capitalise on the illusion of RTTM?


i dont believe accident data is required for roadworks steve

Your response is a bit redundant.

Data is going to be released, this data is what we're talking about. That data can be misused to capitalise on the RTTM illusion of benefit, misused in exactly the same way that the SCPs have done for a decade.
"At camera sites"; I didn't mention roadworks.


yet the "cash cow" is a roadwork site

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PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2011 12:19 
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camera operator wrote:
yet the "cash cow" is a roadwork site

Your responses are getting increasingly off track.

I was talking about RTTM. I amplify: the article stated:
article wrote:
Councils in England have been told to release casualty and accident numbers for every camera site, before and after its installation.

Key words:
- numbers
- every
- before
- after

Nothing to do with roadworks; all to do with RTTM.

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