Safe Speed Forums

Did mother never tell you to "set a good example", meaning to behave yourself? It didn't involve bossing the other kids around, merely behaving during the school trip or whatever. Likewise we should go out and practice good roadcraft, setting an example by our actions.

Cant believe some of the posts that are coming in on this subject - perhaps Jeremy Vine would be better having a phone in for blinkered bloggers, tiresome threaders, flat forums or even cr**py contributors

And we thought mlm's were ruining the driving experience

Robin - totally agree - we need to all behave on the roads - and some contributors are making themselves look a bit silly if they are preaching otherwise.

Unfotunately there we're lumbered by the current rules and regs - but that doesnt give people a free for all if they dont believe in them.

In BBC reports earlier today they monitored outputs of co2 from cars - and found on average the co2 output went up by a third when driving slightly faster than the 70 limit at a paltry 80mph!!!

So lets do us all a favour and try and stick closer to the speed limits - or they'll end up giving similar rules to USA - or worse having specs everywhere!!!

So do you agree with the answers given on how to best fix the MLM problem? You didn't seem to disagree. In fact you haven't acknowledged many questions asked of you....


You are! Worse still it causes unnecessary congestion.


Sorry, who is preaching otherwise? If no-one did then why exactly did you say that?

So if I increase the speed of my car from 70 to 80 mph then I use 33% more fuel per mile?

Regarding 'Captain Flash':

PH thread

it was 30% they said 30% in the report and rounded it up for effect. In the words of Peter Kay it’s mathematical bulls$%t, they seem to forget distance travelled. Surely it would be more value if was CO2 produced per mile travelled. A nice scientific investigation brought to you by DfT

_________________
Oct 11 Birmingham Half Marathon. I am running for the British Heart Foundation.
http://www.justgiving.com/Rob-Taylor

An engine does the same revs per mile at any speed, so why does how fast matter, given a steady throttle?

There will be a buildup of air pressure in front of a moving vehicle (the air has to be 'pushed' out of the way), this serves to slow the vehicle down - drag. The faster it goes, the more the pressure builds up, the more energy is expended in pushing it out of the way.
This pressure buildup is approximately proportional to the square of the (air) speed; this is where the 30% figure comes from [((8/7)(8/7)) = 1.306]. I doubt it is as much as that because cars are being increasingly refined such that the drag isn't so significant compared to the other (linear) losses.

I wondered if the testers factored in the wind? The pull from other vehicles will exaggerate the resultant figure.


edit: from now on could we post related posts in here: Eco-motoring 'to help save planet', thanks.

You mean those who deliberately or ignorantly do not keep left, presumably.

I only support your view that we all need to behave on the road.

Sorry, I dont subscribe to your other self centred propaganda. I will not condone people who are on the whole self serving and trying to get to their destination faster, more dangerously, with less patience and breaking the current laws so blatantly.

I've said many times that I've tried to stick to the rules - and people who believe they are more important bully me and others out of the way when were ligit in our overtaking.

Most of you just need to move into l3 - when you have them down south - and when you dont, ensure you have a modecum of patience for those ahead of you that dont want to break the law like yourselves.

peegee are you actaually reading anything posted in this thread or simply dropping in random posts?

Roflmao!

So you only agree with my view as far as it serves you, the rest of the compliance with best practice is self-centred propoganda?

Sorry, but I've made the point time and time again, no one is complaining about people in any lane who are overtaking legitimately. The complaints are against those who remain in those lanes when they needn't. You have already confessed to hogging lanes through some misguided ideas of lay-policing. Don't act all high and mighty regarding people you think are speeding, when you cannot even comply with simple driving conventions yourself.

the trouble is robinxe is that no one seems to be able to admit that its bad/dangerous for people speeding behind slower overtakers in the situation you describe above - and I agree with your above sentiment on proper overtaking also.

the overall feeling is that we "slo's" slow legal overtakers are just supposed to jump out of the way - and spend more time looking behind us incase a "sisi" self import speeding illegal deems it necessary to rush up behind us and be all agressive - and give us the "oi move it".

so if the slo's and the sisi's could even out a bit and the sisi's become more patient/responsible - then the percieved majority of reported mlm's and any other acronyms you throw out at us will be solved...

Excessive speed differential is of course dangerous. The real problem is one of expectation. I believe it's reasonable nowadays to reasonable expect traffic to be travelling at up to 100 (add much more for emergency vehicles), simply because it's fairly common. Competent drivers should be able to anticipate this; we should be able to roughly determine speed differentials of up to 70mph otherwise how we manage to pull onto DCs without sliproads?


Now would this be the third or forth time I've told you, all without acknowledgement from you, that no-one expects you to 'jump'. You are wrongly and deliberately giving a loaded statement.


How does the MLM know if others are being aggressive or simply reminding them of their obligation or warning them of their presence? (as I have already pointed out to you) There is a big difference!


That's a nice acronym you've thrown at us!
If the MLMs became more patient/responsible then there would be no problem anyway! Deliberately 'hacking off' others for the pleasure of it is not a sign of a responsible driver.


I don't know why I keep replying; yYour random posts more than suggests that all your arguments in defence of MLMing have been demolished.


MLMing cannot be justified (beyond reasons of selfishness); not MLMing can and has been justified - without rebuttal.

Look, I've said it so many times, you could at least have the decency to acknowledge and agree that noone here has suggested that anyone overtaking should ever have to 'jumo out of the way', unless they choose to do so fopr reasons of their own safety.

You keep diverting the topic away from the real issue, which is the fact that you, and others, feel they are justified in holding the middle lane when the road to the left is clear.

Smeegy is advising on expecting drivers to be approaching us slower more legal species of the common spotted driver - at the speed of up to 100mph...

talk about sinking your own boat...

as for reliant robinxe - wow - I'm not diverting anything - no one will admit their a crappy driver and like that same "mind set" no one will admit that breaking the law and harrassing people out of your way is not the way forward...

If this is the best we can expect - long may the govt keep the limit at 70 - god of choice help you if they raised it !!! Smeggit and Xe would be going at 120 and bull bars so they can scrape us slo's of their bumpers when they reach their more important destination.

Because you keep coming up with new ways for us to sink your argument.


So why does it 'sink my boat'? Do you really believe it is right for you to claim that without any supportive argument? Don't worry, I'm not expecting an answer!

So what do you do when an emergency response vehicle passes?
How did you manage on the Autobahn? Do you remember those questions I asked you 3 pages ago?
What speed were you doing in L2?
Did you never have to pull into L1?
Did you unnecessarily impede anyone? (especially those whooshing past at 160)
If you can make proper use of lanes over there then why not over here too?

Like I said, if you're incapable of acting appropriately in regard to a differential speed of only 30mph then perhaps you should revise your skill set.


Given the portion of issues raised that you have dodged, I think we can let the reader be the judge of that!


The real crappy drivers are the ones who like to encourage road rage, such as deliberately hacking off other drivers (you must really regret making that first post huh?), so ironically it is you who is doing the harassment.


"you assume too much and try and to "catagorise" people without a stitch of evidence!" Those are your exact words! Your "inability to avoid personal slights." (again your words) is showing.


Your flawed, dismissive and antagonistic argument style has summed up MLMs perfectly. Keep digging!

Um, no! People frequently do use those sorts of speeds on the motorway, and greater! For right or wrong, that is a fact of life. You seem to be teetering on the edge of the pitfall that has claimed so many, by basing your driving on what people should do, rather than what they do do.

What speed were you doing in L2?
the speed limit as posted on gantries on the autobahn - with cameras and german "gantry camera" equivalent. Saw many people slightly above that on one journey getting "flashed". Most people did the same and adhered to speed limit give or take 10 kmh
Did you never have to pull into L1?
Very seldom had to - as the roads were very busy due to local holidays plus well disciplined speed limit lorries. They also had sections where they had the hard shoulder that could be legally used as a fourth lane - again most of the time stuck in the l1 next to their l0 - so I guess the equiv of l2 - again lots of lane discipline for lorries.
Did you unnecessarily impede anyone? (especially those whooshing past at 160)
Me thinks you've not driven in germany of late. There are far more "active" cameras - and police are very visible there. I can honestly say in 10 days of driving long distances every day the amount of people doing above the speed limit as much as that were very few.
The amount of unrestricted autobahn is much less than you'd expect also now. One other thing is people over there stick to the "rain" speed limits too.
If you can make proper use of lanes over there then why not over here too?
I do make proper use here - you've always blamed me without any justification - and never once said that reckless speeds and approach of drivers ahead is irresponsible or dangerous.

You've already said that you'd do high speed smeggy and so has robin - so its no slight on you if I'm mentioning it in context... Your the one advocating "faster therefore more important to get out of the road of them" not me... We're just putting together the picture you two have painted thus far... I'm not accusing you of anything you havent already validated and condoned with your previous posts.

As for Robin - he just says - ooh that ok to overtake like that at 70mph - but doesnt advocate better manners by those rushing up to us law abiders. As he doesnt do this - then we can see that he's along with you smeggy and expecting people to fall out of your way...

And robin - up our way I regularly drive motorways and duals - and the amount of people that swoosh by at 100 are few and far between -
most people play it safe between 80 and 90 - still illegal but wont attract a ban - up here if your 90 to 100 then you can expect a "go to court" badge from the police person - and a little wait before the local sheriff laughs with mirth at your stupidity... To summerise that everyones doing it doing it frankly makes your point even less valid.

You experince of germany is different from mine, my parents (who live there) Last time I drove on the autobahn was March, I think. I covered about 400 miles. Yes there where limits at some points, however these where for good reason.Maybe it was a different time of day to you however I had no difficulty using L1, even when I was doing +100 mph.

I hate to say it, but I am beging to feel you don't inhabit the same planet as me and others.

_________________
Oct 11 Birmingham Half Marathon. I am running for the British Heart Foundation.
http://www.justgiving.com/Rob-Taylor