Safe Speed Forums

Hello

As some of you may or may not know I have only been driving for nine months.

I have started to encounter fog.

Other than slowing down, and putting the fog lights on are there any other things I need to consider.

(To my ausement on motorways little signs light up to tell you when it's foggy).

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Oct 11 Birmingham Half Marathon. I am running for the British Heart Foundation.
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One of the critical dangers with fog is when it suddenly gets thick. Usually this is the experience of driving into a fog bank. Both obvious reactions can get you into deep trouble.

If you brake hard because you can't see someone might strike you from behind.

If you avoid harsh braking when you can't see you might crash into someone who braked hard

The only answer here is to adjust your speed in good time to cope with poor visibility. I do know these days BEFORE I drive into fog that's much thicker, but I don't think I used to know and recall the 'brake or not' dilema quite a bit from years ago. I think it's mainly about being used to what fog looks like fom a driver's perspective.

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Paul Smith
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this is an 'out there' suggestion but if possible when it's really bad consider not driving because even if you're sensible you just know that some !%"£)*!"%)* behind you thinks they're safe as long as they don't exceed the speed limit.

I drove along the M5 in light fog this evening.
What struck me was, although the fog was light and visibility was several hundred yards, most people had their rear foglights on. Many of them were so bright as to be blinding - and many were actually much brighter than their brakelights. This seems dangerous to me, because it could 'mask' brakelights and lead to a hazardous situation.
I wish that people would only use their foglights when and where lack of visibility demands it.

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well it was definitely fog light weather from brum to warwick tonight.

still a few with with fogs + sidelights although as i drove it occured to me that this might actually avoid the usual dipped lights reflecting off the fog. i tried it for a millisecond when it was quiet, and since you're going that slowly anyway it wasn't any worse, not good for being visible to other drivers tho'.

full beam is usually a no no but i did find some patches of light or patchy fog where the trade off was worth it as it picked out the cats eyes & reflectives through the fog.

at one point i reverted into advanced style commentary, partly cos i was bored at pootling along at a safe speed and partly to keep me alert, particularly through what are normally fairly hazard dense residential areas at the best of times.

and my final thought, as i got back into town i did actually take the rear fogs off. the guy in the queue 2ft behind me i hope appreciated it (i'm thinking he can see me anyway!) and i preferred in this scenario not to risk masking the brake lights.

its all good tho'

One thing i have tried out, found it quite by accident on our transit vans.
On the open road when foggy and main beam reflects off the fog, and dip not quite good enough, have tried using the load adjuster on the headlamps on main beam to provide optimum forward beam with minimum dazzle - don't know if it works as well on cars though - but another idea to try.If it works for you - good, if it don't please don't nag

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lets bring sanity back to speed limits.
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Not a bad idea Botach.

Ree.t, excellent question, you've only been driving 9 months you say, yet you come up with a hugely sensible question, that most drivers don't even think about.
I wish more drivers asked question like that, and they allege to be more experienced than you.

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Semper in excreta, nur quantitat variat.

One more suggestion , the experienced ones will either know about it or have had it done to them - and i've only once had the chance to ask a numpty why, oh why and got a blank look
Why oh why, when the fog is thick, you're in the country taking it easy some idiot of the first order catches up with you , won't go past and blinds you with their lights both bouncing of te fog and off your mirrors causing you to have to slow down even more , and still they won't pass .

OOPS the suggestion was to let someone else guide you along - but give them breathing space to see ahead.

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lets bring sanity back to speed limits.
Drivers are like donkeys -they respond best to a carrot, not a stick .Road safety experts are like Asses - best kept covered up ,or sat on

I was gonna let rip on a serious rant

I cannot comprehend it. Wildy had the same experiences too!

What got the fur ruffled to point of ?

the number of numpties this evening who seem to think that high beam is the right headlamp to use in fog?

Not only did these muppets just light up the fog in a white sheath ahead of them - but they used to fog lights when it cleared :banghead; Some even overtook at speeds at the speed limit but conditions warranted a speed much much lower as you really could not see very far at all.

Yeah - speed camera would really have detected these muppets driving dangerously - because I'll face facts here - they were !

Oh - we lost count of the number of lentilist muppets of non-cyclists we encountered in

dark clothes, no lights, on rural lanes

We both got seriously held up in jams and met up at our slip road where I escorted Wildy back home or she led me home - which ever.

The only good thing about this evening was that the twins had cooked the evening meal ready for us when we got in and it was a jolly nice meal too! (a truly wickedly rare steak with all the trimmings! )

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Beware of stupid pedestrans and cyclists who think that grey or black coats and no lights is ok.

If you are unfortunate enough to break down. try to leave hazards and fog lights on.

Remember to turn off all your lights when you park at work ( not all cars have a buzzer) it is realy 'orrid coming back to a flat battery

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This was the original idea of fog lights, for use in very dense fog on unlit roads at night, driving with front Fog lights and sidelights can be far more effective than dipped beam.

But only really effective when fog is so bad that safe speed is very low - so quite why so many drive around with sidelights and fog lights at 70+ mph i can't explain.

During a short stay in London I came across very bad fog ( 70s) and bought some fog lights and driving light ( flat topped & flat top beam, under the bumper cibie) - and had problem of how to set them up.Came across a helpful trafpol who showed me how /where to mount them and how to align them . His advice - set fog lights low to light up fog from underneath , fog lamp on nearside to see kerb, driving lamp on off side to light up road. - never had any problem being seen or seeing where i was going after that in bad visibility ( fog/snow)

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lets bring sanity back to speed limits.
Drivers are like donkeys -they respond best to a carrot, not a stick .Road safety experts are like Asses - best kept covered up ,or sat on

Thank you I do have my moments

And thank you all for your tips

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Oct 11 Birmingham Half Marathon. I am running for the British Heart Foundation.
http://www.justgiving.com/Rob-Taylor

I think it worth mentioning that fog comes in different types!!
It can vary from a dense layer close to the road surface, to quite a deep fog, well over the height of surrounding trees and features.
The latter is more disorientating, as the only objects you see to guage your speed and position from, are relatively close to you.
Fog lights low down are designed to shine BENEATH the layer of fog, and you view the road (hopefully) through the unlit vapour above. In these circumstances, it CAN be beneficial to have side lights and fogs.
However your speed and other factors such as street lighting, and separation from oncoming traffic must be taken into account.

I noticed on the A592 on Sunday evening, that the lights of oncoming vehicles approaching over rises and round corners, illuminated the fog on MY side of the road to the extent it robbed me of any forward vision until their lights swung past me. That is the sort of unexpected hazard you must be prepared for.

This morning Windermere was clear of fog, and sunny. Troutbeck Bridge, a mere mile away along the A591 was bathed in THICK fog.
As I waited to exit the Lakes School driveway, in just 2-3 minutes I saw over 15 vehicles pass by with NO lights on at all - just looming out of the gloom. The vehicle which was behind me had no lights either - and in the distance I was able to accellerate from the junction, I lost sight of the vehicle as it exited a second or so behind me!!!!
Surely the oncoming vehicle with no lights must indicate to these moronic individuals that their own vehicle is a hazard???

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Real fog or just a bit of mist?

It's a few years since I saw any real fog.

Before you dive for the foglamp switch. First operate your wipers and demister, make sur eit's not just your screen which is fogged up.

Then have a look at the car in front. Can you see the tail lights on it? If you can then and you are following at a reasonable distance, and there is traffic behind, then you don't need your foglamps on. If there is nothing behind then you might want your foglamps on in slightly clearer conditions to give advance warning to anyone catching up.

It strikes me that the majority of the population just don't know how to use their vehicle's lights correctly at all. I don't recall being taught when I learned to drive. My basic approach is as follows, and any thoughts would be appreciated...

I NEVER use only sidelights when driving. IMO if its dull enough to need to illuminate your vehicle, sidelights just aren't bright / visible enough. I've never heard the theory about using sidelights in thick fog, and so far I've never had to drive in conditions that were that bad, but it does make good sense. As for rear fogs (I've never owned a car fitted with front fogs) I treat them like mainbeam - that is, if its foggy enough to use them (visibility seriously low, not just a bit hazy as some people seem to think), if a vehicle approaches from behind and its clear that he can see me I switch them off. I would certainly never dream of leaving them on for an entire journey because in my experience they do nothing else but dazzle any vehicles close behind. Again, I've never had to drive in REALLY thick fog where visibility is so bad that you could only see a few feet, and in that situation I probably WOULD leave them on all the time.

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If you're on an unlit rural road in really thick fog (so thick you really can't see where the road's going), use a car ahead as a 'pathfinder'. Give it plenty of room and let it find the road for you. Use your rear foglamps to improve your conspicuity to a following vehicle but switch them off once you're sure he's 'acquired' you if you may be dazzling him by keeping them on.

If you are the 'pathfinder', front foglamps will usually help visibility. Full beam will almost certainly be worse than useless. Concentrate on following the nearside verge rather than trying to follow the entire road width.

I've used my Sat Nav before as a 'pathfinder' - lets you know if right or left hander coming up, how sharp & if any junctions are up ahead. (It wont tell you about stopped / crawling cars with a scared woman at the wheel of her micra) - other than that it works a treat

I'm not sure that the way foglights are designed to be used always helps.
My car has automatic lights that come on when it gets dark, or when the automatic wiper system detects that it is raining. But the system cannot detect fog, so unless its dark I may need to switch the lights on manually, the onlt time I ever need to do so.

But my real gripe is the foglights. Rear foglights I tend to switch on when I can see nobody behind, and switch them off when being followed if I can see the following vehicle clearly. They are useful in both daylight and nighttime fogs.

Front foglights are not much use in daylight fogs IME, they add nothing that dipped healights are not already doing, but the rear ones may enable you to be seen by someone catching up. But on my car it is not possible to have the rear floglights on without the front ones being on as well ( it is possible the other way round).

So for daylight driving I need to have the front foglights on as well if I want to use the rear ones. I suppose it does no harm in reasonable daylight, though but I can imagine conditions where the battery of lights on the front of my car could dazzle someone when all I want is to been seen in good time by faster traffic from behind.

I've used the load adjust thingys for many a year in the fog too. wise words about if you can see other cars tail lights you don't need your fogs on.

You know it's foggy when you get disorienated on familar roads, I'm not joking either. Remember driving round the J4 roundabout on M54 for what seemed like ages and thought this must be the M54 west by now. Nar took the wrong exit. balls. proper fog that.